Skip Nav | Home | Mobile | Editorial Guidelines | Mission Statement | About Us | Contact | Help | Security | Support Us

World

Foolish of IMC to Water Down its radicalness

unbridled artist network | 06.02.2004 07:23 | Analysis | World

Allegations are arising that the IMC momentum is already slowing down due to too much administrative handiwork. An anarchist discussion points out possible reasons and solutions. Points to consider: the meta of control desires, pros/cons of restrictive protection vs enriching protection

we don't have to let others' expedient interests tool us
we don't have to let others' expedient interests tool us


There is an interesting discussion happening on infoshop.org (a place where such happen regularly). See the link at bottom or top and go check it out.

Down below an interesting article about activating ourselves, you can see a few people are talking about the pros and cons of the IMC project and how its numbers are allegedly dwindling--at least on some IMC sites. I don't know where they get their info, but I for one can imagine such happening as more IMC admins believe they must introduce more "protective" restrictions due to "off-topic" and troll-like postings.

Following is a reply I made to infoshop which goes over various possibilities to be aware of for individuals who wish to keep the authenticity of the IMC project at least minimally excellent.

People (minus various forms of Vanguards, single and in groups) ARE in a psycholgical place where venting and chaos are NEEDED--as an authentic processing point of departure from a world in which they are COMPLETELY ENCOURAGED to be AT WAR with each other (thus, do not spend time on contexts, empathy, or the like, and just VENT AT). i'll go into this more below.

For now, i want to point out that there are probably various metas at work here which should be discussed by anarchists (and all others who want serious evolution/"revolution", not more facades) if we are to avoid those pitfalls (i assume anarchists wish to avoid such pitfalls, tho figure that those more ideologically inclined wish to mask over this kind of discussion).

For instance, the meta value system of saying on the one hand that one has "an alternative" (or "The alternative") to the giant corporate media, but on the other, plays the same old game of propaganda/hype, i.e.: the needs of ideology first and foremost. (the fortress of those subordinated to Is over those they are purporting to serve and free)

The situation of the Vanguard (usually the admin of the project) *over* the not articulate/semi-articulate (usually the general posters). For various reasons, the Vanguard deems it necessary to dam the chaotic flow of those who reflect the insanity/inanity of their experience.

To dam the flow and "protect" by restriction,,,,

They do not see the value of just letting that flow go wherever it goes. And actually playing out their stated values WHEN IT MOST COUNTS!

I've seen the pattern time and again; situations are more and more restricted until the original momentum begins to lose steam. Like a few people [in the discussion] are pointing out.

(Then, of course, the Vanguard throws up its hands and figures "radical" change is "impossible" and a new generation of "sell-outs" takes its Place with the older generations (i'm not saying to "sell-out" is completely 'bad'; there are grey areas to this which should be looked into for decisive value))

The trick is to promote this venting, and to out-wit the ways in which liberation momentums have, up to now, always been led to the dead ends of superficial reform. To realize the value of this venting as something to CELEBRATE.

Bear with me before you dismiss this out of hand!

i would promote such a chaos, such an inarticulate, semi-articulate (or, even a possibly *more articulate*--as having gifts in ways we may not perceive) chaos of free-flowing posters/publishers on projects like the IMCs as a type of ceremonial processing, a "dance" that MUST be done, BEFORE serious evolution can take place.

Take a step away for awhile and look at the bigger picture.

This project is like no other so-called "mature" project because it STILL mostly adheres to its preachings of inclusion and independence. Okay. Now, a lot of "right-wingers" have been spending a lot of time there (what is it to be "right-wing" anyway? i say to be "right-wing" is to be MORE conditioned, have more wool pulled over ones eyes, and in dire need of MORE critical thinking!!!!).

People are spending a lot of time and a kind of momentum was building (before the Vanguard began curtailing it behind-the-scenes). Despite the alleged "badness" of Left/anarchist information not getting 'cleanly' to the followers, a lot of people were starting to take a LOT of time to try to get a hand in influencing and being influenced. There was (and may well still be some) a real liberating effect--if only in its infancy.

Cynics and the most ideologically conscious might point out that there is a hieararchy of groups who are more valued than others. This brings up hard questions; questions that challenge the basis for our allegations of wishing to have a different kind of world than the one we are programmed to consume and subordinate to. Some of those questions are masked over by hype that we have not caught onto, by persons with interests we are not always keen to.

Persons who many would call trolls (i.e. the guy who used to post from Ithica, NY until major pressure came down on him directly via the strange behavior of some) are swept into a kind of ghetto. THOSE people are not "valuable" participants, categorically. For many reasons that many can accept. But then the thing broadens out, and pretty soon, people like ChuckO (main infoshop admin) find themselves treated similarly.

So these are hard questions. And as long as we let others make decisions on these, we give away more of our power to create the kind of realities we desire.

same old ideologically-challenged games
BECAUSE the same old ideologically-challenged games were being subordinated to, one couldn't easily expose the meta propaganda/hype and MOVE ON/evolve.

Example: Rightwingism couldn't be exposed BECAUSE to do so in any serious way would be to teach people intellectual self-defense--teach them how rightwingers play their games; this would be TOO MUCH simply BECAUSE the Left/conscious leftwingers play this game as well!!!!!!!!!!!!

And one "simply could not risk" going so radical (much much too radical) as to pull the whole game right from underneath the rightwingers' feet. bEcause to do THAT would be to unplug/scuttle the Left while scuttling the Right!

And to the "pragmatic" strategists of the Left (older activists dominating younger, "less skilled" "less experienced" "greenhorn" activists who "don't really know what they're doing"****see bottom note) that would simply be TOO RISKY.

Why? BECAUSE these older Vanguardists have dibs in the status quo. THEY are not (yet) being affected. THEY do not REALLY want to have a "revolution" or evolution. THEY simply do not BELIEVE in such things. But they do WANT to feel like they're doing something.

Maybe it's the kind of hardline cynicism so many of us see in our own parents. Or maybe there *is* wisdom in not allowing true radical momentums to build without bloodshed and without more involvement by the courts. Or maybe it's something like Chomsky has shed light on: internalized values. People who have internalized the value system of their society in a way that they are being tooled, and do not see it.

Whatever the reason, the question comes down to: do you/we have the NERVE to go ahead with our dreams and desires anyway?

--------------------------------------------
****note:
It's then easy for these "greenhorn" activists to fall for the meta situation where the bottom line interest of the Vanguard/"wise leaders" is to integrate with the more "established" and "reputable" community. Thus the IMC project as "politically immature" in the eyes of older activist types. And thus the older activist types not telling their followers about the IMC project, and thus adding to the allegedly growing "disinterest". A "Catch-22" if i ever heard one.

My final statement:
We may have to break completely from this old way of doing things and create a new place for committed resistance consciousness to grow and flower and reproduce, and pioneer a kind of progress that we can taste and be nourished by, and have reason to remain on this planet seeking the excellence of our original visions--the DESIRE that first brought us to this work!

unbridled artist network
- Homepage: http://www.infoshop.org/inews/stories.php?story=04/01/28/8166259

Comments

Display the following 5 comments

  1. An important debate — Pete
  2. Yeah, and what do you want? — bn
  3. hmm — c_merengo
  4. heated discussion here (reply 1 of 3) — unbridled
  5. c_merengo, thanks! (reply 2 of 3) — unbridled

Publish

Publish your news

Do you need help with publishing?

/regional publish include --> /regional search include -->

World Topics

Afghanistan
Analysis
Animal Liberation
Anti-Nuclear
Anti-militarism
Anti-racism
Bio-technology
Climate Chaos
Culture
Ecology
Education
Energy Crisis
Fracking
Free Spaces
Gender
Globalisation
Health
History
Indymedia
Iraq
Migration
Ocean Defence
Other Press
Palestine
Policing
Public sector cuts
Repression
Social Struggles
Technology
Terror War
Workers' Movements
Zapatista

Kollektives

Birmingham
Cambridge
Liverpool
London
Oxford
Sheffield
South Coast
Wales
World

Other UK IMCs
Bristol/South West
London
Northern Indymedia
Scotland

Server Appeal Radio Page Video Page Indymedia Cinema Offline Newsheet

secure Encrypted Page

You are viewing this page using an encrypted connection. If you bookmark this page or send its address in an email you might want to use the un-encrypted address of this page.

If you recieved a warning about an untrusted root certificate please install the CAcert root certificate, for more information see the security page.

IMCs


www.indymedia.org

Projects
print
radio
satellite tv
video

Africa

Europe
antwerpen
armenia
athens
austria
barcelona
belarus
belgium
belgrade
brussels
bulgaria
calabria
croatia
cyprus
emilia-romagna
estrecho / madiaq
galiza
germany
grenoble
hungary
ireland
istanbul
italy
la plana
liege
liguria
lille
linksunten
lombardia
madrid
malta
marseille
nantes
napoli
netherlands
northern england
nottingham imc
paris/île-de-france
patras
piemonte
poland
portugal
roma
romania
russia
sardegna
scotland
sverige
switzerland
torun
toscana
ukraine
united kingdom
valencia

Latin America
argentina
bolivia
chiapas
chile
chile sur
cmi brasil
cmi sucre
colombia
ecuador
mexico
peru
puerto rico
qollasuyu
rosario
santiago
tijuana
uruguay
valparaiso
venezuela

Oceania
aotearoa
brisbane
burma
darwin
jakarta
manila
melbourne
perth
qc
sydney

South Asia
india


United States
arizona
arkansas
asheville
atlanta
Austin
binghamton
boston
buffalo
chicago
cleveland
colorado
columbus
dc
hawaii
houston
hudson mohawk
kansas city
la
madison
maine
miami
michigan
milwaukee
minneapolis/st. paul
new hampshire
new jersey
new mexico
new orleans
north carolina
north texas
nyc
oklahoma
philadelphia
pittsburgh
portland
richmond
rochester
rogue valley
saint louis
san diego
san francisco
san francisco bay area
santa barbara
santa cruz, ca
sarasota
seattle
tampa bay
united states
urbana-champaign
vermont
western mass
worcester

West Asia
Armenia
Beirut
Israel
Palestine

Topics
biotech

Process
fbi/legal updates
mailing lists
process & imc docs
tech