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English people are ignorant and racist when it comes to Wales and its culture.

Rugydy ryddy | 04.08.2003 21:57 | Anti-racism | Globalisation | London

A couple of weeks ago, I can’t remember which newspaper it was, one of the tabloids decided that North Wales is the rudest place in the United Kingdom. They complained that the people in the shops or pubs started talking Welsh as soon as you came in there. But of course that didn’t have anything to do with the English people coming in there, people have always spoken Welsh there. Just to give you an idea - speaking another language is seen as rude in the United Kingdom. It’s not seen as anything positive, as building a multilingual, multicultural environment'.

This is one of the comments that Simon Thomas makes when he describes the attitudes he meets in his job. He claims that English people in general are ignorant when it comes to Wales and its culture.

Wales, and the Welsh language have been in the spotlight recently, with the debates on its future following each other. The Party of Wales, Plaid Cymru, has been in the centre of discussions that have on one side accused Welsh politics of 'racism' towards English immigrants, and on the other side of not doing enough for the safeguarding of Welsh language and culture. Plaid Cymru's Simon Thomas has been a Member of Parliament in London since February 2000.‘A couple of weeks ago, I can’t remember which newspaper it was, one of the tabloids decided that North Wales is the rudest place in the United Kingdom. They complained that the people in the shops or pubs started talking Welsh as soon as you came in there. But of course that didn’t have anything to do with the English people coming in there, people have always spoken Welsh there. Just to give you an idea - speaking another language is seen as rude in the United Kingdom. It’s not seen as anything positive, as building a multilingual, multicultural environment'.

This is one of the comments that Simon Thomas makes when he describes the attitudes he meets in his job. He claims that English people in general are ignorant when it comes to Wales and its culture.

'And I mean ignorant in the full sense of the word - which is basically don’t know, as well as even if they did know, they wouldn’t be interested. I asked a question of the Prime Minister last week, about Afghanistan, and as I was asking, one of the Labour backbenches shouted out ‘go back to the hills’. That’s the mind attitude that they’ve got.'

Simon Thomas, a Plaid Cymru member representing the constituency of Ceredigion, has got a tricky job. While this is the attitude of some of his colleagues in London, his party has also been accused of not doing enough to safeguard the Welsh language and culture and instead trying to get English votes. Thomas defends his party by saying that it is a growing party and that they need the support of the English in order to get more power in Cardiff.

‘Ultimately, my job is to wrestle power away from London, into Cardiff and to get more evolution in Wales, and to see strong Welsh institutions being established. One MP, two MP’s - or even forty, can’t change peoples’ attitudes. What changes attitudes is seeing political power being exercised.'

This is the long-term goal of Simon Thomas. He says, 'there’s a lot of people saying that we shouldn’t be here, that we should be in Cardiff. I think we should remember that we are actually a part of the United Kingdom, and we have a contribution to make. Obviously our longterm aim is to move the power to a European level and to Cardiff, but while it is happening at a British level, I personally want to be part of it.'

But what about a Welsh future in Europe? Will London always be the centre of power for the Welsh, or will it be sidetracked by a stronger Europe one day?

Simon Thomas doesn't see a marginalized London as impossibility. It depends on how active a role they chose to have, he says.

‘This makes it even more important for Wales to get representation in Europe. If London gets marginalized in Europe and we’re marginalized in London, we’re never going to get any recognition. There are two tracks to go down for Wales. One is to remain with the United Kingdom and hope that it becomes more of a federal state, that it develops along the lines of Spain, giving autonomy to it’s regions. The other track is to recognise that this state has never shown any sign of devolving or becoming federal, and to instead try to get Wales into the Union as a member state. This is obviously not going to happen in the near future, we’re talking 20 to 25 years, and by that stage Europe will also look different.’

Rugydy ryddy

Comments

Hide the following 15 comments

English uneducated rabble.

05.08.2003 06:07

Speaking as a Englishman whatever that means i find most English both ignorant and uneducated.This of course is not a problem confined to the English as the educational system in most western societies is not true education but training designed to produce work fodder for the service economy.The english people i associate with are not living in the 21c but in the late 19c and early 20c in their social and political outlook.This perspective clouds all their thinking when considering other cultures and peoples.Wales is indeed another country and one in which i take frequent summer holidays i find most people in Wales both polite and considerate and would like to learn their language so as to develope a better understanding of Welsh culture and people.The English must learn that they live on a diverse and culturaly diasporic island and that the whole of Britain does not revolve around the south-east of England.

Redkop


Don't be ignorant

05.08.2003 08:27

Well I think that both of you are clearly demonstrating your ignorance. About 2 minutes research would have told you that the original article was written by Dai Llewellyn, whose family have been in Wales for generations, for the Mail on Sunday (15Jun). I'm sure now that people reading this site will be jumping up and down saying it's just a right-wing rag, but that is where the article actually did appear, and I'm sure it's read in Wales too. One of the main points of the article was that the promotion of the Welsh language is being used to promote nationalism generally, with all its consequent negative features. The article was nothing to do with the English.

Paul Edwards


A CAN OF WORMS?

05.08.2003 08:28

I wonder the intent of the writer "Rugydy ryddy". The article does not read as if written by a Plaid Cymru member.

In 1954 a Welsh spy detected a conspiracy to use economic forces to destroy the Welsh Nation. It has worked so well that Simon Thomas, Plaid Cymru MP for Ceredigion is now dependent on the votes of English inmigrants to be returned to Parliament. There are enough of the better sort for that to happen. There are also the worst sort, they have sold up in their home towns to get away from the "Pakis". They come to Wales and bring their racist prejudices with them, and apply them to the Welsh. They are a potent source of race conflict. Last year a group of patriotic youths celebrating the life and lamenting the death of Llewllyn set up a chant "White Pakis". I did not then understand what they were on about, perhaps I now see a reason for it. ... A mickey taking taunt.

Hot news in Wales today is that a black woman is made a member of the Gorsedd Circle, but then she lives in Crymych, just across the road from where refugee Haile Selassie first stayed in Wales. As the symbol of his Nation's struggle for independence, he was guarded by welsh speakers who volunteered to put their live at risk to give him an armed guard against a possible Italian hit squad. That at a time whan the UK and French Governments were killing the League of Nations by supporting Mussolini's atrocious war to take over Abyssinia.

People who were at Selar are likely to know Alice. The lesson is that it is menes, not genes that count in Wales.

But to return to the can of worms in the article: Patriots want a free and independent Wales able to participate in full in the International Community of Nations. Any person selling that objective short is a traitor. To be a part of Europe without achieving independence is to abandon Nationhood, it is no better than being part of the UK. those who have been doing their damnedest to undermine the UK will, if the implications in this article are true, have an equal duty to destroy the E.U.

I still puzzle the intent of our mystery author.

ab Alun


Ref dont be ignorant.

05.08.2003 09:35

My intent was to outline using my own experiences that the English are both backward looking and ignorant when in contact with diverse and differing cultures other than their own.Nationalism remains a sad fact for both the English and Welsh peoples.This problem is not condoned by myself and it is of no use trying to hide zenophobia and cultural elitism that is so often displayed and encouraged by ruling elites.History as taught in most secondary Schools is only a representation written by the apologists of Capitalism and the nation state.Furthermore it is a bourgeois representation that is believed by the vast majority of English people.I do not hold with the beliefs of the Welsh nationalist parties but encounter the cultural elitism shown by the English on a day-to-day basis.No doubt Welsh nationalism is just as rabid as the English variant however this was not my original argument.To outline my original point one only as to examine the popular press attitudes to asylum seekers racialism and intolerance of this kind is believed and repeated everyday by the uneducated rabble.

Redkop


"by the uneducated rabble"

05.08.2003 09:55

Not that you are some kind of eliteist, oh no perish the thought1

It must be because I am so uneducated that your whole comment comes across as smug arrogance.

Sonic


To sonic

05.08.2003 11:42

What i am or what my views are remain completely irrelavent when faced with the facts of mindless nationalism.Icannot help to offend people when voicing my own experiences of mindless and uneducated views expressed by the people i meet in everyday life.These are the facts of the matter and not simply my interpretation or view of English society.Moreover their is a deeper and more philosophical current running through this whole issue.Once again i state that i react to and write about my own personnal exprience of English people when faced with divergent cultures of which they appear to have no understanding.Elitism does not enter into these facts.

Redkop


always use a clear and meaningful title and clear the lungs before singing-smile

05.08.2003 12:02


I remember in London quite enjoying the welsh button on the telephone boxes.
Each public access of unit of British Telecom who supply telecommunication equipment to many multi-lingual overseas countries and regions of not only the €U, better known perhaps as the common market but beyond even further in the lands far flung of the former empire indeed and new found trading partners.
BT as the multi-national-corporation sells itself the snappy global firm, affords four languages an option on the kiosk phone box.

ah the Red phone box.
from the Falklands to Hollywood, in Ireland they painted them green then blue and white for Eircom, but in London, red.
Press the language button next time you're in a Phonebox.

today is welsh reading day.
 http://www.indymedia.ie/newswire.php?story_id=60653

BT make more money than Wales every day.

ipsiphi


Wales? Shcmales!

05.08.2003 12:27

I have never thought much about Wales. I adore Dylan Thomas. I love the thought of green valleys. But still, I can't say I have thought more or less about it than about England.
I don't see what all the fuss is about!

Observer


To observer

05.08.2003 12:41

To observer,JOLLY HOCKEY STICKS!.....anyone for TENNIS?Need i say more?

Redkop


Wales: A Dump

05.08.2003 13:37

Wales is a dump and sadly cant be blamed on the 'ignorant' english: welsh 'nationalosm' like that really gets up my nose: as if whether you can speak welsh should be the barometer of human worth!
hailie salisie was a dictator..ordinary ethiopians had to bow before him so i cant say welsh people guarding the black mussolini is anything to be proud of!
And thats not even starting on the feuds between north wales and south!

Some one who Lives in Brecon


A warm welcome in wales awaits the hun english

05.08.2003 22:25

Well done, stuck up, snobby, snooty english deserve everything they get. Why not freeze them out of conversations, they'd only bore us to tears anyway. Give them a taste of their own snooty exclusive yuppie cliqueness. The arrogant english think their soo sophisticated, and that the welsh must bow,and scrap to accomodate lord snooty english snobbastard. We must tug our forlocks and tip our caps to our urban english holidaying masters, and greet them with mugs of warm welsh ale and a hearty, hello squire!.
Yes give english holiday makers a warm welcome, burn out their holiday mansions and cottages.

going native in wales


Ahhh..think I'll buy my THIRD holiday home in Wales

06.08.2003 08:31

ahh..yeah think i'll buy a nice cottage or three in wales..dont know what the dippy taffs are complaining about after all THEIR Prince is English so why not welcome english people too?

Simon Saxon


hypocrites!

06.08.2003 12:52

Well i think it's totally hypocritical of IMC leftists how you always jump in to defend the Welsh when you'd never let anyone else get away with sexism or homophobia..

..oh no sorry, wrong minority..

anon


islamophobia isnt a joke

07.08.2003 14:37

What a surprise the muslim community is the butt of racist jokes again did you get that from wwwleftshatemuslims.com? you cant compare the welsh who suffer from nothing more than envy of the english to the oppression of the muslims why dont you just join the bnp as im sure they will welcome racists like you lot with open arms

Sonic


oops sorry Sonic

07.08.2003 16:11

Actually I was trying to satirise the knee-jerk anti-Islam posters..

Humour is a dangerous game, innit?

anon


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