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LATE NOTICE - 7-7/9-11 Connections meeting in Beeston, Leeds

dh | 12.12.2005 23:55

Some members of blamed root communities harbour warranted fear and unwarranted guilt as a result of mass mind-bending operations aimed at labelling them guilty parties
We can only heal the divisiveness by uniting to expose the fabrications aimed at splitting society apart

The Hamara Centre, Beeston, Leeds.
In the youth wing on Lodge Street, two of the so-called London bombers were said to have met with the "leader" of the group on many occasions. See
 http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,1529005,00.html

Exercises were taking place at the time of the 911 attacks and at the time of the 7/7 bombings. These two events and many others in the world of staged terror events are inextricably linked

The TATP "Mother of Satan" explosives were supposedly mixed in the bathroom of a house in the Beeston area, see
 http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,22989-1695442,00.html though evidence suggests military-grade explosives were used in the actual bombings

TATP bombs , including one wrapped with large nails, were allegedly left in the boot of the car left at Luton station car park

EXPOSING THE TRUTH AND THE 9/11-7/7 CONNECTIONS at THE HAMARA CENTRE, TEMPEST ROAD, BEESTON, LEEDS

Including ex-MI5 whistleblowers,David Shayler and Annie Machon, as part of their nationwide itinerary

On WEDNESDAY 14th DECEMBER, 6.30 to 9pm

Connecting to the blamed community and arranged from within

Admission free, voluntary donations welcomed

dh
- e-mail: dwightheet@yahoo.com

Comments

Hide the following 27 comments

...

13.12.2005 10:36

No repsect for others grief!

NRA


More conspiracy rubbish!

13.12.2005 14:44

This is pure conjecture/opinion.

Unsc


Yawn

13.12.2005 15:15

Another half arsed attemnpt for David Shalyer to get free publicity for his latest book.

Please remove

Buy something better (or nothing at all)


Do honest people use Indymedia still

13.12.2005 22:10

1) To honour the dead and respect those left behind, you must understand the truth
2) The evidence of the complicity or rather the active hand of state forces behind these events is overwhelming, - do you still need to see it? Then perhaps you should attend a meeting like this or investigate over the internet
3) Shayler is invited to speak at this meeting - he has not promulgated, but rather been brought in by concerned individuals and groups nationwide because of insider experience

The state of denial amongst the so-called politically aware and active is one the biggest hands the State and those pulling the strings have in maintaining a status quo of global conflict and planned entropy

dh


Yes...

14.12.2005 10:44

...there are honest people here and the vast majority of them sane too.

You think that turning up to the home of one of the bombers with a circus of loons and some bullshitter flogging a book is respectful? I see it as no better than Chuck Heston or the BNP seizing an opportunity for self-promotion/agrandisement.

As for the rest of your conspiracy ramblings: if it were so clear cut, why is no-one but a bunch of loons backing you? I take it that that is a conspiracy too. Just like the conspiracy that stopped us hearing about WMD lies, Abu Ghraib, Rendition, Torture, White phosphorous, etc etc etc. "Yeah, we really are living in The Matrix, man! ...Skin up!"

Please go find/start a conspiracy forum and leave this venue for people interested in real actual proper bona fide news (as opposed to notices about hobby(horse) meetings).

See, the mission statement and editorial guidlines.

M


No its not...

14.12.2005 14:55

The evidence of the complicity or rather the active hand of state forces behind these events is overwhelming, - do you still need to see it? Then perhaps you should attend a meeting like this or investigate over the internet

This so called 'evidence' is far from overhwhelming, from what I have seen there has been alot of wild speculation over not very much evidence at all.. Most of the 'evidence' appears to be pointing out alleged gaps in the material put forward to support the 'official' view, but an absence of evidence does not, magically, trasform itself into positive evidence for any of the counter claims. Could you kindly highlight the abundant evidence you are referring to please.

speculation is not evidence


Exactly Right

14.12.2005 18:21

The Cover-Up itself is proof of a cover-up.

Like the Bush/PNAC Regime and its singular 911 Conspiracy Theory, upon which it's launched a preconceived agenda of Fascist Madness (Rebuilding America's Defenses - www.newamericancentury.org), which it has been unable to support with key and compelling evidence in over four years, the Bliars would support theirs if they could.

The point is that they cannot, and they have barred any investigation into the event, which should just be second-nature when such a tregdy occurs. If not, what are you paying taxes for?

Bliar then said that the bombs mysteriously left unexploded on on 7/21 would be used to track down the culprits, but too many people pointed out that they were probably planted, a possible witness was shot nine times (seven bullets to the head) by a still-unidentified man, and the police LIED about it, and still, the evidence to support the 7/7 Conspiracy Theory is missing.

And still, Bliar used the tragedy to seize for himself unprecedented powers, those which had been kept from him by the British Courts for four years.

Just like Bush and 911 ...

Begs Serious Investigation


Jordan

14.12.2005 20:56

You are like a stuck record. Why don't you and jack go worry the admins at some conspiracy forum instead of spamming this place with you daft wee theories that most people laugh at?

M


If this were the general consensus

15.12.2005 00:06

Then I would see this line as nothing more than Islamaphobes backing the government in its dissembling on terrorists,libelling a race and a religion, much as the Germans backing Hitler with his lies about the Jews
Some anarchists! - more like some gullible cattle walking the Nazi goosestep

dh


Good

15.12.2005 09:24

Now you established what blinkered bovine drones as anarchists really are perhaps you could consider taking your gospel to a more suitable audience and leaving this site alone.

P.S. A handful of loony sights doesn't constitute a considerable body of support. Try to get out more and meet people and talk to them.

M


Not convinced

15.12.2005 10:35

Those who beleive that 'conspiracism' is the only possible 'progressive' view of recent events are entitled to their view, but I personally disagree, and I am sure I am not the only one who holds this view:

 http://www.publiceye.org/tooclose/conspiracism.html

In addition, I do not think that accepting the possibility that disenchanted Muslims who hold very real grievances against the West may have had the will and capability to carry out these attacks is Islamophobic. On the contrary I find the counter assumption that they could not possibly have done so rather patronising. Just because Blair/Bush have used these attacks as an excuse to wage their own Imperialist war on Afghanistan and the Middle East, does not mean that everyone else accepts that said attacks in any way justified the subsequent response. Accepting the reality of one, does not endorse the other, so please desist in this assumption that people who question these 'conspiracy theories' are somehow 'pro-war'. But the very fact that Blair/Bush subsequently waged war is not in itself proof that they engineered the circumstances that gave rise to it, and I have yet to see any real evidence that this was the case.

I too would welcome a public enquiry, though I beleive that if a public enquiry on 7/7 did end up endorsing the 'official view' you would still remain unconvinced, as it seems that you would always rather beleive there was a cover-up. This is more like religious fervour that rational debate. You are, of course, entitled to your view, but please accept that there are those who remain deeply skeptical.

Sergio


you, M, are

15.12.2005 13:07

... a stuck record all on your own (ie even without the hysterical help of the soros censors here).

It's interesting though, how you deem to attck me even though I had not posted until now on this thread.

I can only conclude that, somewhere in the back of your cluttered mind, you feel threatened.

Tough.

Nobody censors speech they agree with ...

... if [you] can not believe in free speech for those that [you] disagree with, then [you] don't beleive in free speech at all.

Now, I am off to 'go live in Russia / in a cave / start my own site' etc boring etc.

NOT!

jackslucid
mail e-mail: jackslucid@hotmail.com


There is no 'abudant evidence'

15.12.2005 15:06

The TATP "Mother of Satan" explosives were supposedly mixed in the bathroom of a house in the Beeston area...though evidence suggests military-grade explosives were used in the actual bombings

Beyond a very early comment by some French secret service observer on the day of the bombings (ie before any forensic tests have been carried out) that military explosives 'may' have been used - no evidence supporting the military explosive case has ever been produced to my knowledge - what evidence are you referring to?

The upturned edge of one of the bomb craters was noticed by one eyewitness and has been seized upon by conspiracists ever since. I am no forensic expert (and neither was the eyewitness) but it seems to me a bomb going off near a seat (commonly bolted to the floor) may have resulted in part of the metal being turned upwards. Hardly conclusive proof of 'bombs under floors', and I re-iterate, no other eyewitness accounts seem to mention anything at all about this.

The links provided make reference to a video on the links between 9/11 and 7/7 by Ian R Crane.

You can google this bloke quite easily:

 http://www.psalifemastery.com/event/bio_ian.html

His potted biography notes:

Ian has spent many years researching Comparative Mythology, Spirituality and Changes in Individual and Collective Consciousness (The Awakening Process). Ian's research focused initially on the spiritual and esoteric teachings of ancient Egypt but the scope of his research expanded dramatically when a planned four-week trip to Central America turned into an intense seven-month investigation of Mayan spirituality and cosmology in Guatemala , Honduras and Belize.

Precisely the sort of 'expert' well qualified to discuss the technical, forensic and engineering issues relating 7/7 and 9/11 then???


Speculation is not evidence


jack

15.12.2005 15:07

Asking you to go to a more appropriate venue doesn't equal an attack on free speech. This site isn't designed as a conspiracy forum and there are plenty of opportunities for you and Jordan to go to more suitable venues or even quite freely start your own with your own remit and rules (where you'd no doubt ban people like me...).

LMFAO @ "threatened". I keep my fears for the real world. Some loons in Interwebland are of no consequence to me. They are just tiresome to have to wade through when trying to find valid content.

M


Indeed. But Serious Doubts Remain.

15.12.2005 18:03

The Cover-Up itself is proof of a cover-up.

Like the Bush/PNAC Regime and its singular 911 Conspiracy Theory, upon which it's launched a preconceived agenda of Fascist Madness (Rebuilding America's Defenses - www.newamericancentury.org), which it has been unable to support with key and compelling evidence in over four years, despite being asked to several times, the Bliars would support theirs if they could.

The point is that they cannot, and they have actively barred any investigation into the event, something which should just be second-nature when such a tregedy occurs. If not, what are you paying taxes for? That, in itself, is irregular and suspicious behaviour. The Burden of Proof rests upon those "leaders", who have been caught LYING to further their agenda, to support their allegations, especially when those allegations are then used to "justify" illegal, aggressive warfare.

Bliar said that the bombs mysteriously left unexploded on 7/21 would be used to track down the culprits, but too many people pointed out that they were probably planted, a possible witness was shot nine times (seven bullets to the head) by a still-unidentified man, who shot at him 15 times while he lay prone on the ground, the police then LIED about what happened, and still, the evidence to support the 7/7 Conspiracy Theory is missing.

Bliar used the tragedy to seize for himself unprecedented powers, those which had been kept from him by the British Courts for four years.

Just like Bush and 911 ...

Begs Serious Investigation


some people ...

15.12.2005 18:23

... are addicted to this concept, this semantic cul de sac, of "conspiracy" or "conspiracy theory" ... they use it incessently, and only in a pecularly pejorative sense ...

... if these people would care to examine their reaction to these words and also bone up on their general theories of semantics and language (try korzybsky & chomsky)

 http://www.general-semantics.org/
 http://www.chomsky.info/

... they would realise what asses they have been making of themselves!

Talk about tiresome ... yes you can ask me (and every other person you disagree with) to "move" to another venue ... but, since this isn't venue - it's cyberspace - and you don't own it (or do you?!?) ... thats all you can do.

I find it tiresome wading through nonsense also, and am fatigued by the general low level of learning by those with the most stringent of views, find it frustrating to debate with those hiding an agenda, despair at those who use [any] means to silence their critics, detractors and antagonists ... but hey, thats life. Tough.

What I do not do is call for ejection, fractionalisation, tribal schisms, heirarchies, or the aboragation, abandonment or arbitary transfer of responsibilty or power to [another] human.

I'll leave that to reactionaries and fascists.

jackslucid
mail e-mail: jackslucid@hotmail.com


jack

15.12.2005 18:59

The phrase you are looking for is "connotation". I've probably read more linguistics than you will ever... does that make now credible???

The bottom line is you and your copy&paste lexical-Tuerrete's-suffing mate Jordan just stomp around chauvinistically promoting the most speculative and baseless speculations as fact/news. Tart it up with all the polysyllables you like, at the end of the day it's just tosh. And this is a news site not a conspiracy forum. Your activities are by defintion antisocial and I'm pleased to see that certain volunteers are starting to tire of it also.

m


ha ha ha!

15.12.2005 21:05

If you can not or will not see what this statement:

"I've probably read more linguistics than you will ever"

... says about you, then I am not suprised that you seek to both characterise my opposition to your comfortable assumptions as 'anti-social' (read: mentally ill - see defining the new dissent as mental illness) and to claim patronage by those 'with power' (and thus offer up dim threats of censure and repudiation).

Water off a ducks back ... the facts remain, as ever, the facts.

Face them or not, it's no skin of my nose whether you believe then moon is made of green cheese - I do not seek to prevent you from doing so. That the same is not true for you, shows who the reactionary is between the two of us - a quality of mind independant of the knowledge crammed into it.

But I guess I and the opinions I have must be eliminated for the greater good - I'll go fall on my sword now shall I?

jackslucid
mail e-mail: jackslucid@hotmail.com


Talking of which......

15.12.2005 21:22

...our other Jordon Troll clone, ol' Twlight, seems strangely silent these days.

This is not, I must stress, any sort of complaint.

Paranoid Pete


One last time

15.12.2005 22:43

Conventional exposives in rucksacks are unlikely to punch holes in reinforced carriage floors whilst failing to blow out much flimsier carriage sides

 http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/popup?id=979901&content=&page=3

Haroon Aswat apparently had a number of mobile phone conversations with the 7/7 bombers
He avoided arrest over a number of years due to the intervention of the US Justice Department and in South Africa, from British Intelligence. He is MI6, and wasn't arrested in Zambia until after the 21/7 flour bombings

 http://www.officialconfusion.com/videos/lond_small.wmv

dh


I'll never get off here!

15.12.2005 23:03

That previous was a wrong link. Here is the correct

 http://www.officialconfusion.com/Videos/lond_small.wmv

And this little movie might help

 http://www.officialconfusion.com/Videos/77r4.wmv

dh


jackslucid

16.12.2005 12:21

You were the one bandying around "I'm cleverer because I have read stuff" arguments, not me. You get the responses you illicit.

Paranoia is a real mental illness. Certain people here typifiy the symptoms. They see persecution where there is no logical reason to. Either they are just bored, possibly stupid or they are mentally ill.

The fact that you keep asserting what anybody that opposes your silly wee theories believes doesn't do your standing much good either. The few times I have felt it neccessary to speculate on these events, I have hardly presented a verbatim endorsement to No 10's propaganda.

To recap: what you, Jordan and others are doing is abusing a newswire to present teneous speculative conspiracy theories. This isn't the appropriate venue. Please go somewhere more suitable. You'll notice that I'm not telling you stop discussing the matter. Just asking you to go somewhere else to do it.

P.S. Pete: well he's still here but largely just cutting and pasting short rants with his usual catchphrases. Which is a welcome improvement.

m


Quick hint:

16.12.2005 15:36

If you are going to use double quote moarks "", make sure that it is something that has been said that is in them - otherwise you deliberatly misrepresent the person to which you attribute the quote (a dishonest act).

If you wish to paraphrase [me], then "I'm cleverer because I have read stuff" (note the quote marks - it is something you actually said!) - is a pretty poor attempt. Perhaps you misunderstand (the best motive I can attribute), then again perhaps you aim to disrupt (more likely).

Merely repeating the ghastly notion that people who disagree with [your] position are mentally ill (and I see that you are no longer pretending that you mean "anti-social" - see again the "" quote marks for something you actually said ... getting it now?) does not make it true, pleasent or clever.

Merely repeating the worn out meaningless phrase "conspiracy theory" does not lend any more credance to [your] version of events, relying, as they do on a lack of rigerous examination and not a surfit.

"You'll notice that I'm not telling you stop discussing the matter. Just asking you to go somewhere else to do it."

Good. But you are repeating yourself.

To repeat myself: I'm not going anywhere (although I do use and contribute to a wide number of sites and "venues" already, under a number of psudos.

Perhaps it is you that would feel more at home elsewhere ... somewhere where you are not challanged (how rude of us) and where they will appreciate your insight (I'm loath to suggest anywhere, but perhaps la la land might suit!?! ... only joking)

Please indicate where I have asserted "what anybody that opposes your silly wee theories believes" and explain why, if they are so silly, you have failed so miserabley to counter them with argument (rather than assert that you have and then call for the removal, exclusion and ridicule of the asserter).

Finally, something to make you smile (perhaps?) and to remove the burdon of discrediting me and thus free yourself to concentrate on issues rather than personalities (some hope!):

...

I'm a pig. I'm a selfhater. I'm an unreconstructed anarchist.

I hate my mother. I hate my father. I hate my dead great-grandparents.

I write bad checks. I sleep with my dog.

Happy?

Now, can we get to the real issues?

...

(Oh no, I just realised that I used this technology stuff to cut and paste that last bit from another thread - now you know I must be evil!?!)

PS - it has been observed and noted just exactly which of dh's comments have been deleted - not hidden, deleted - in this, the thread he started. How lame.

Good to here from you again dh, I guess it's not stamina that keeps me here, just plain old stupidity ... that and the ego driven desire not to die on my knees but on my feet ...

Love and power to you and yours (and too all - why not, it's xmas or something).

Now - at last - the issues:

I fail to see in whose interest is served by the lack of an enquiry into the revolting episode now known as 7/7 - if not those with something to hide.

The fact that a grassroots movement is attempting to take responsibilty for their community and the safety of its members is comendable. I would be interested to hear the results of this evening (I live to far away to attend).

It would seem from my neive viewpoint, that this is exactly the kind of event, covering exactly the kind of issues, that the indymedia project should embrace ... and whilst I see no movement yet to ban this thread and 'outlaw' the speaking of the issues therin, it is worrying that so many who make the effort to post here can not accept this self evident truth.

Justice can only be served through recourse to all the facts and not just the ones that are palletable to ones own set of predjudices and preconceptions. the truth does not always have an easy birth, sometimes drastic attention is needed to ensure it is not still born - especially with the increasing centralisation of media power ... centralised around those same names, faces and corporations that stand to benefit most from 'burying bad news'.

The war on terra is still ongoing. I see no let up in the machinations and rhetoric that would ratchett it up another notch and make more martyers & sacrifical victims and abandon the advances of several generations of freedom fighters and social reformers.

It is vital - if not encumbant on us - to ensure that this does not happen, or at least at no cost to the fascism of corporate dominance over lifeforms. As such, I emplore and beg for a halt to the fractionalisation and tendancy to name call and ridicule.

Refusal to keep an open mind about issues poorly understood and researched is ignorant ... and ignorance kills.

jackslucid
mail e-mail: jackslucid@hotmail.com


blimey

16.12.2005 19:08

"Arguing" "punctuation" "is" "the" "domain" "of" the desperately ill-equipped. Naybe you and Danny can join the Keith Warehouse Fan Club and piss off." Or maybe you can actually learnto interpret quotation marks as a form of expresiiom- watch my face turn blue.

You "see", my mind is so "wide open" I am "looking" for "evidence" where you have all don & dusted as a big conspiracy by Dr Evil and have al the clever catchphrases to back it up.

Geez peace and go somewhere you are wanted!

m


Please Update Us

16.12.2005 23:00

A Theory, built upon evidence and the behaviour of suspects, is what any good scientist or detective uses to arrive at a solid, fact-based conclusion. The barring of an investigation, by LYING War Criminals, in situations where investigations should be second-nature, proves that there is a cover-up. The only things left to determine now is why are they covering up the truth, and what is the truth - what happened, and who was responsible.

Don't Let Them Limit The Debate


Nearing the bottom of the page

17.12.2005 00:52

I don't think many go beyond the first page so I've settled a way upline
 http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2005/12/330030.html

dh


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