Anarchist Bookfair best ever!
Heidi | 22.10.2001 22:55
Heidi
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Heidi | 22.10.2001 22:55
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Comments
Hide the following 17 comments
Notes from the Borderland
23.10.2001 00:54
harry a
Whilst the onslaught continues on Afganistan.
23.10.2001 12:02
If you want people to get involved in the anarchist movement wouldn't it be better to offer something positive like mass anti-war action or teach-ins. Nobody is being forced to get involved in the SWP or any of the campaigns it's involved in. Nobody is forced to go to the GR conference or it's protests. If you feel so strongly why don't you provide an alternative. Just slagging off other people without doing so is not attractive to anybody.
You can go on about Kronstadt until you are blue in the face but thats not going to impress anybody who wants a political strategy fighting capitalism in 2001 not saving/making a revolution in a starving Russia in 1921.
The SWP has made a serious political criticism of the dangerous and elitist actions of the Black Bloc in Genoa and were not the only ones. From some peoples reaction it seems any form of criticism is not allowed.
This is thankfully not the case with respect to Hardt and I suspect Negri. For instance Callinicos is debating Hardt
on the issue of the book Empire (which he and Negri wrote) at SOAS 6.30 on Friday. Maybe you should go and join in if you feel so strongly.
socialist
Recuperation of dissent
23.10.2001 12:30
I agree in part with your sentiments that the best
way for anyone to disagree in an idealogy or
tactic is to pose an alternative, hopefully this will
come about through the 'no war but the class war'
network which is setting up across the country.
But you must not forget that one element that anarchist
are fighting and are always fighting is the recuperation the state uses to dis-empower people. This function
is in most parts supported by extra-state institutions like CND, the 'left' and it's trot sects. These institutions
are based on a demand on the state to act and at the
same time to perpetuate there own power base. To
me these elements are undesirable for a movement
against war as it leads to co-option and a hiding of
the fact that only a mass global revolution and attack
on the capitalist infrastructure can stop not just this
war but all wars.
So the fight and criticism of SWP, CND, Worker Power,
ARROW..etc is part of the struggle for a true movement
which will produce a collapse in there war machine.
@
No war but the class war
Meets 7.30pm
at Sebbon Street community centre
sebbon street
Islington
anarchist
e-mail:
.
Homepage:
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Try the outside world
23.10.2001 12:56
vincent
How predictable
23.10.2001 12:59
And "whilst the onslaught continues on Afganistan" you would have thought you would have better things to highlight than "Callinicos is debating Hardt on the issue of the book Empire".
Could the SWP please grow up, stop patronising people they have political disagreements with and maybe see the irony in one of the British left's numerous sects lecturing people who have been involved in direct action for years about how to avoid sectarianism.
james
Shut it! says SWP
23.10.2001 14:21
Charles Mowbray
charles mowbray
e-mail:
charlesmowbray@hotmail.com
To Anarchist and James
23.10.2001 14:41
I've got much more respect for people who are trying to build something against this bloody war than those who seem to have a complete obsession with what the SWP is doing rather than doing anything themselves. This is the problem that James ignores. Criticising other political viewpoints is essential but the emphasis makes all the difference. Why was the session on the SWP the most exciting thing at the Anarchist Bookfare as the original post implies? Isn't that a ludicrously distorted way of looking at things when we are trying to stop a war ?
The SWP attacked the Black Bloc tactics and that had to be said but it was not the main thrust of what we had to say at all about Genoa. The debate over Empire is an extremely minor issue for the SWP which is spending 99% of it's energy on building the Stop The War Coalition (and arguing socialist anti-imperialist politics within it).
The problem with 'No War But The Class War' is that you would end up with a very small anti-war campaign indeed
if you only work with people who realise a revolution is necessary and possible as a final solution to war. I'd rather be in a broad campaign full of pacifists, CNDers, Greens, disgruntled Labourites, Muslims, trade unionists, anarchists and whoever else and argue within it as real issues come up as how to take it forward. All these kinds of people worked together to get 50,000 on the last demo. We need even more next time.
See you on November 18 !
socialist
Patronizing
23.10.2001 16:06
Not being from the UK I'm amazed.
Patronizing along about what anarchists should better do or better not do.
Condemning Blac Bloc actions and inmediatley hiding behind other people, because they were not the only ones...........
Having more respect for people who do something against this war, than for people who critisize them.
Last but not least, "rather being in a broad campaign, ......etc>
phoe
I hate people who wan't to rule me
pentagram
By the way
23.10.2001 16:14
james
just to state the obvious...
23.10.2001 16:18
on the events of September 11th and the war at the
anarchist bookfair. There was also pamphlets and
magazines with articles against it.
so, please, SWP members, grow up! And don't forget,
the SWP were taking this "there is too much other
important stuff to do than critique us" line before
the start of the war....
Basically, its the usual case of "we can attack yous,
but you cannot critique us" (and I use the term
"attack" as the SWP do not present an honest
critique of anarchism, as shown by Pat Stack's
article in Socialist Review).
And, btw, I find the dismissal of learning from history
somewhat ironic from a Marxist, given they usually
stress how important it is that we do so! History did
not start on 11th september and we should study and
learn from it so we will not repeat the same mistakes
again (like let Leninists take power, for example).
anarcho
e-mail:
anarcho@geocities.com
Homepage:
www.anarchistfaq.org
I hate people who do rule me!
23.10.2001 16:56
Potential ruler??
Sectarianism
23.10.2001 21:27
Apart from the fact that the SWP/GR workshop was just one of dozens, I think it's absurd to accuse us of sectarianism when the SWP always devotes at least one workshop at their Marxism conference to attacking anarchists.
Lemming
e-mail:
avlemming@hushmail.com
SWP sabotage
23.10.2001 22:00
Thanks,
GtR
Genoseize Therat
1 anarchist against the black bloc
24.10.2001 06:36
My other observations is that it is macho and unnecessarily violent towards vague targets. I don't really see them as being a big part of the revolutionary movement other than gathering media attention.
These are my observations as an anti-authoritarian socialist!
ahamin
time for a truce?
24.10.2001 11:02
I hereby propose a truce on UK IMC, between the SWP and anti-SWP posters. Between us we're clogging up what is really a news site with Leninism v anarchism, a controversy which is hardly news!
Such a truce needn't significantly impede debate, as views on all sides are readily available in publications and on websites, and there are plenty of discussion boards. What it would do is take it off IMC, which I suspect would be a relief to many.
Incidentally, this is off my own bat, not an 'official' thing.
Ben Drake
e-mail:
ben.drake@york.gov.uk
another comment
24.10.2001 11:30
actually, its a very valid position and a natural
response to oppression. Its not pathetic, its the
voice of freedom.
>Can't you tell the difference between political argument
> between people fighting the system and the reality of
> capitalist oppression exploitation and violence.
There is also the question of whether the people who
are fighting capitalist oppression, exploitation and
violence are trying to replace it with "socialist"
oppression, exploitation and violence. Sorry, but that
is a valid concern -- the assumption is we want the
same thing but unfortunately we do not. As the
Bolsheviks made clear, they wanted party power, not
workers' power.
> Of course if everybody who is an anarchist is beyond
> criticism and everybody who isn't i.e (i.e communists,
> revolutionary socialists, syndicalists, Labourites)
> is out for world domination (there must be an easier
> way!!?) there is no need to trouble yourself with
> thinking about difficult questions from others.
no one is above criticism, although the SWP does seem
to think that they are! After all, this is how this all
started when an anarchist mentioned a meeting which was
based on criticising the SWP -- we were informed that
there were much too many other things to do, so we
had better shut up! Still, didn't stop the SWP producing
somethings critical of the autonomist Marxists!
And are you seriously suggesting that the SWP and other
Bolsheviks are not seeking power for their own party?
Or that the Bolsheviks ended up arguing for party
dictatorship (including Trotsky, who did so right to
his death)? Sorry, but you cannot claim to follow the
ideas of Lenin and Trotsky and deny their authoritarian
actions and ideas.
But I suppose its easier to not answer that sort of
thing than actually admit that Bolshevism is not that
democratic in reality...
Iain
anarcho
e-mail:
anarcho@geocities.com
Homepage:
www.anarchistfaq.org
the truce is out there?
26.10.2001 10:20
Ben Drake
e-mail:
ben.drake@york.gov.uk