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Homophobia on Dr Who

David Mason | 23.03.2005 17:49 | Gender | Indymedia | Social Struggles

Queer as Folk author, Russell T Davies complained about a gay-bashing joke on children's tv. Now his new Doctor Who script includes a homophobic remark which is presumably designed to give the program 'street cred' but is no better than the homophobia he complained about in The Guardian.

I found an example of homophobia in Dr Who which was written by Russell T Davies of all people.

Last night on Radio2 there was a program about the new series, and about 48 minutes into the program there was a sound clip of Rose saying 'you're so gay' to the doctor after he said that a slap on his face by Rose's mother had hurt him.

The new school guidance on tackling homophobia and bullying makes a point of stressing that 'gay' should not be used in a negative way, and says schools should "log all homophobic language and homophobic violence by any pupils or staff. This includes calling someone or something 'gay' with a derogatory meaning, or comments that question an individual's masculinity or femininity."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/aod/sxsw_aod.shtml?radio2/r2_who

http://www.wiredforhealth.gov.uk/cat.php?catid=1101

Rose: She [Rose's mother] slapped you?
Doctor: 900 years in space and I've never been slapped by someone's mother
Rose [mocking] Your face
Doctor: IT HURTS!
Rose: You're so gay.

Two years ago Russell T Davies complained about homophobia on Children's tv (Basil Brush) but it looks like he's now guilty of it himself, which is a bit hypocritical of him, I think.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/tv_and_radio/story/0,3604,926125,00.html

Russell said: "I always liked writing for children because I knew that, if I got it right, I could create a moment which could burn itself into the brain. We'll all remember our favourite kids' shows when we're 70. We might remember nothing else. But there's more than memory at stake here. The younger the audience, the more impressionable. They're learning behaviour and they learn a lot from TV."

Dr Who is being promoted as family entertainment. There is still time for Russell to do the right thing and ask for this (and any other homophobic remarks) to be edited out. I have already tried to contact him about this, but no response so far.

David

David Mason

Comments

Hide the following 16 comments

Oh Who cares??? (geddit?!!)

23.03.2005 18:52

Cheer up and be happy! Afterall we live in a multicultural society!!!

Tarquin

No

24.03.2005 01:13

I'm glad that this programme isn't obsessed with political corectness. I'd sooner not have my son brought up to act like some eunuch who's obsessed with being 'sensitive' to every perverted freak in the world.

Humpty Dumpty

Russell T Davies

24.03.2005 06:40

Well, first of all, 'Humpty Dumpty' (above) adds nothing to the debate but has gatecrashed it to have a slanging match with anyone who he thinks is gay. Rather pathetic misuse of Indymedia really. Whilst Russell T Davies is undoubtedly a populist TV producer, I find it rather difficult to believe that he has consciously set out to promote homophobia. In his 1999 production 'Queer as Folk' a number of characters made homophobic comments - and all ultimately ended up with egg on their faces for it. Perhaps he intends the same for his Doctor Who scripts. In any case, Davies is on record in the gay monthly magazine 'Attitude' that he never responds to letters about his work - either positive or negative - so it may not be appropriate to try and contact him in this way.

Indpendent Left

Doctor Who...

24.03.2005 13:20

...is more important than politics.

Troughton
mail e-mail: killallthecoppers@yahoo.co.uk

Dr Who. . .

24.03.2005 17:16

. . .made me do physics. and after 8 years i conclude, i still can not solve Reimann Tensors in my head :(

i have failed as a timelord :(

oh well, biology it is!! *cough* ali j, *cough* ali j ;)

physicist

PC gone mad??!!??

24.03.2005 19:48

Thanks for drawing my attention to the Radio 2 broadcast- I enjoyed listening to it whilst editing up and laying out the current newsletter for our allotment society- but as for being homophobic?? Methinks you are being over-sensitive the 'your so gay' comment made me smile. Bsides I thought 'gay' was a positive term, not derogatory??

Sorry but I think you are making a mountain out of a molehill.

Graham

so what do all the folks (queer or otherwise) reckon?

27.03.2005 00:17

So what do folks reckon to the new Dr who? I enjoyed it on the whole, but agreed with the Grauniard comment that it was for 'the ritalin generation'- 45 minutes is nowhere near long enough to develop plot, storylines, etc. properly. The Autons weren't as scarey as first time around either...
Didn't notice any homophobia, I liked the 'It won't last, he's gay, she's an alien' line when the doc was flicking through the celeb mag...

Cheers

Graham
Homepage: http://www.spiralseed.co.uk

reply to "homophobia" remark

28.03.2005 19:25

i really don't believe that this remark is homophobic, its just harmless fun. Get a life, and a sense of humour.

gay person

I'm glad somebody raised this issue

11.04.2005 01:06

I agree that the word gay should not have to be associated with negative stereotypes and should thus not be used as an insult. In response to the other comments here, it is not just harmless fun, it's par of the way society continues to stigmatise homosexuals. Fifty years ago, calling someone a "filthy arab" would have been normal. The people who defend the show, defend it not because they know that it is harmless but because it is an everyday normality and is socially acceptable. That of course doesn not even come close to being a decent justification.

People need to start taking gay rights more seriously and I am particularly disappointed in this website for including categories for anti-racism, immigration, gender but not sexuality. Funny thought that they particularly seem to have emphasised this comment in Dr Who when this is hardly the only time the BBC or indeed TV in general has been guilty of homophobia. What about that loud, crude, vulgar, unfunny show on Channel 4 Bo Solecta which just about every episode would make fun of that fact that Melanie B is a lesbian, Jonathon Ross's show which puts up "Four Poofs on a Piano" as an object of amusement for the audience, lest we forget Nevermind The Buzzcocks which was full to the brink of allusions to sodomy when Right Said Fred. Nobody has to feel ashamed for standing up to this kind of crap and I have as much respect for a gay man or lesbian who finds it acceptable as a feminist would have for a miserable housewife.

As for you hypocrites accusing the article of political correctness, I wonder how you would have responded if a TV show made a joke out of someone likening a stupid or unemployed person to being black. It wouldn't have been so funny then.

Dave
mail e-mail: maxwellshammer2@aol.com

That's So Black... Muslim... Jewish!!!!

19.04.2005 21:14

Dear David

I completely agree with your point, have you thought of going and complaining to the bbc via their website they have a section specifically for this kind of thing!

People are too quick to dismiss comments like 'that's so gay' as harmless fun, but if a comment was to be made 'that's so black' when someone was seen displaying criminal behaviour, or 'that's so jewish' when someone is tight-fisted there would be an immediate outcry! because this type of negative stereotyping is dangerous and offensive!
Therefore equating gayness with negative or weak behaviour is as unacceptable as any other form of prejudice and we should all remember that ‘All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing’

Jennie

'First they came for the Communists, but I was not a Communist, so I said nothing. Then they came for the Social Democrats, but I was not a Social Democrat, so I did nothing. Then came the trade unionists, but I was not a trade unionist. And then they came for the Jews, but I was not a Jew, so I did little. Then when they came for me, there was no one left to stand up for me.'

Jennie Gallagher

Gosh, you're out of touch!

26.06.2005 11:15

You won't find this in the Oxford Dictionary, nor even in Peeves (yet). But Davies is aiming Dr Who at a very broad audience, so expect some "young" language. The BBC is looking into this phrase in any case, so don't think it's not being thought about; take a look at the thread.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/teens/talk/your_say.shtml

I too would deplore the use of "gay" as an insult, but here it isn't being used as one. Look at the context; Rose was gently poking fun at the Doctor's reaction, not delivering a thunderous condemnation.

Now consider the wider context; it's worth bearing in mind that both the writer and executive producer of this episode are gay themselves, and that the series includes a bisexual man "Captain Jack" who is also macho as hell, not to mention good-looking. For the wider contemplation of homophobia/philia in Dr Who, see here.

http://forum.digitalspy.co.uk/board/showthread.php?t=236786

Right, that's the balanced bit over with. Personally I have to say I think you're talking utter rubbish. If we eliminated every part of the english tongue that had a historical pejorative root, it would be a very poor language indeed. I have just binned an article calling for the banning of the sale of kitchen knives with pointed tips because apparently they're dangerous, and this is the same thing. Language is a razor-tipped scalpel - don't try to censor it with a lumphammer!

Of course you're within your rights to make this call. Historically speaking, convention dictates that everyone argues for a while, and then concensus decides the outcome. However, with the advent of PC (now thankfully passing its zenith) concensus and debate have been underemphasized, largely out of fear of giving offence - for instance, the way in which Britain's Afro-Carribean and Asian communities have had to reclaim the word "black" from the PC brigade simply because it is a label some of them prefer to the anodyne "coloured".

To summarize, don't you DARE try to tell me what language to use, what films to see, what books to read.

Andy McKee

Stereotyping contrary to BBC Producers' Guidelines 2.2

04.07.2005 17:13

I too would deplore the use of "gay" as an insult, but here it isn't being used as one. Look at the context; Rose was gently poking fun at the Doctor's reaction, not delivering a thunderous condemnation.

Exactly - you could say whenever "gay" is used in a deprecatory manner it is "gently poking fun." However it diminishes in some sense the person being addressed because of the allusions and associations it has come to posses, partly as a result of this usage itself.

In the past the verb "to jew" was used as a term of rebuke. Thankfully it's hardly ever heard today. It's not a question of being politically correct but simply correct

The BBC producer guidelines - section 2.2 - deals with "Hurtful or inaccurate stereotypes." A recent case deserves quoting:

[quote]
Complaint upheld over 'gay slap' remark

Jul 28 2004

icWales

THE BBC upheld a complaint against one of its commentators for describing an altercation between rugby players as a "gay slap".

Brian Moore, a former England International, made the comment about an ineffectual blow delivered during a Six Nations Grandstand game this year.

Ten viewers complained about the phrase, aired during February's Scotland v England game, saying it reinforced stereotypes about gay people.

The BBC said the comment was "inconsistent with the BBC's guidelines about avoiding hurtful or inaccurate stereotypes" but added there was no intention to offend.

The commentators were briefed about the unacceptability of such terminology before an investigation was carried out into the matter, it said.
[/quote]

David M

BBC allows homophobic remarks - proved

07.07.2005 17:22

Andy,

I clicked on the first link you gave. One of the comments was from Melissa, who said that gays hate straight people, and so she was homophobic and proud of it. I tried to reply with : 'Melissa - some white people don't like black people, and some black people don't like white people. But that doesn't mean that it's a good thing to be a proud racist does it? Anyone who's racist or homophobic is prejudiced and that is a bad thing to be.'

Guess what? The BBC moderators didn't put through my response, but instead immediately changed the discussion subject which seemed to have there for over a week. It has now been changed again because of the bomb outrage.

Suppose someone said they were proud to be racist because black people hate whites. Would the moderators have allowed that comment through too? What you called 'looking into this phrase' is in fact the BBC moderators allowing through such disgraceful comments, both on their web pages and sometimes on tv too, even in spite of their own tv producers' guidelines.

David Mason

Wow - Just read this article, you MUST feel silly now!

24.07.2005 14:55

Well, having let the series develop, and seeing Captain Jack introduced, (and responding to another poster, 45 mins was more than enough to let the 'Bad Wolf' thread develop) I hope you both feel rather silly. Once one views the whole series, not individual episodes, you see a really powerful intelligent series. The public response is amazing. I was just doing some googling for "Captain Jack" and "Dr Who" to see what the general feeling was and was so pleased to see that generally, people were fine with it. Even Jack kissing the Dr in Ep.1.

When QaF went out, the nation were up in arms. Now, a 'gay' kiss in Dr Who on Prime-time BBC1 on a saturday night? Hardly a murmer.

How times change.

The Todd Corry storyline, and the wonderful Antony Cotton in Corrie ongoing?

I think a lot of that is to do with Russel's work on QaF, and I never doubted he'd have a success in this format (I remember his CBBC work!) that included blond Nazi lesbians. Jumping on one phrase here was knee-jerk! You don't work in the Gvt do you? The series thread 'Bad Wolf' was so cleverly put in, and everything wound together beautifully. The few cliff hangers we did have (Aliens of London/World War 3, and The Empty Child/The Doctor Dances, Bad Wolf/The Parting of the Ways, were perfect. Combined with the thread revolving arounf Adam in Dalek and the Long Game created a series that felt a little 'epic' when viewed as a whole.

Hee Hee, Egg on your face generally. Heres to two more seasons and Christmas specials, and ongoing success for reinventing viewing on a Saturday night.

Thanks Russel.
x

Ian Bonham
mail e-mail: Bon_the_one@hotmail.com

I stand by all my comments

16.08.2005 11:47

Ok there was a same-sex kiss, but so what? How does that excuse the homophobic remark? And anyway I've proved that the BBC allows homophobia but condemns islamophobia and this is still the case. For example Newsround refuses to give proper coverage to gay news stories and that makes the problems of homophobia and 'coming out' at school worse. And I can give you more examples if you want.

david

You're so gay!

02.01.2007 11:49

He's a musclar guy with a shaved head in a leather jacket, who has no interest in the opposite sex.

Maybe she wasn't making a 'homophobic remark' but stating the bleedin' obvious.

Go to America. There "gay" and "retarded" are both offensive derogatory terms that have become completely accepted and inoffensive through over use by teenagers.

"That's so gay!"

"What? Are you retarded or something?"

I'm not saying it's right. I'm just saying that's the way it is.

Roland Hulme
mail e-mail: rolandhulme@yahoo.co.uk
Homepage: http://www.rolandhulme.com

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