view of a frustrated arm-chair revolutionary
Dave the Rave | 05.07.2005 15:55 | G8 2005
This isn't exactly an article about the events happening over the last couple of days but an opinion.
I've been reading the press coverage of the direct actions in edinburgh yesterday and feel totally alienated from the anti-capitalist movement right now, something I have felt strongly in favour of for several years. I have always verbally defended our cause in discussions with friends, work mates etc. Now I feel like I'm running out of steam and enthusiasm to to argue issues til I'm blue in the face cos we're just going the wrong way in terms of the image we're putting across.
According to the bbc/a public witness a taxi driver and even a police horse was attacked yesterday.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4652027.stm
I mean, what the hell are you doing? How is anyone going to even listen to our cause let alone find out about it, understand and even support it, when this happens. I understand the nature and bias of the mainstream media but this information is from a bystander. For God's sake we're getting ahead of ourselves. The average person doesn't have a clue what anarchism is or what it stands for, they think we're a bunch of extremist yobs! They happily (now, thanks to actions like yesterday) lump us in with football hooligans and religious extremists. They do not know we're doing these things in support of THEM and that we want THEM to join us in the struggle. We're totally alienating the people we need to help us. And if this movement is to get anywhere we should educate first and act later. My girlfriend of nearly two years doesn't even understand anarchism, and I can't explain it without being patronising of shoving it down her throat. I defended the 'idiots' on TV but now I don't think I should anymore. I'm fed up with people being so irresponsible. May Day is now a farce, all I see is crusties in dreadlocks drinking carlsberg special brew grunting "f*ck the police" (I'm in a library so I had to censor the swearing). What the hell is it with dreadlocks and sandals? Anarchism is a highly sophisticated political ideology, this fails to get through... we need office workers, builders, mechanics etc. These are real working class people. The general public accume all anti-capitalists are hippies on the dole or students and so get us every time with their "get a job" quips.
We need to make them realise this is for their benefit, their destiny, their world. I say 'their', I mean 'our' of course. But right now joe public is alienated, confused, amused and angry at the idea of anarchism or libertarian socialism and it's the most frustrating thing. We need to change and take it one step at a time. Educate then act, not act like a tw*t and expect others to sympathise... attacking taxi drivers, digging up flower beds, having a go at a horse... what the hell?! We should act in self defence only and only use physical action when we need to push though a police line, which we can if we all act at once together if there is many of us. They can't arrest us all if we keep sharp and moving.
Maybe a good tactic is to dress up as big teddy bears and fluffy animals for some direct action. How would that look on TV, police beating up a big furry bear.
Sorry this is more of a rant but I wanted to get these thoughts out, I hope I wasn't patronising and sorry about the grammar and spelling.
Thanks.
I've been reading the press coverage of the direct actions in edinburgh yesterday and feel totally alienated from the anti-capitalist movement right now, something I have felt strongly in favour of for several years. I have always verbally defended our cause in discussions with friends, work mates etc. Now I feel like I'm running out of steam and enthusiasm to to argue issues til I'm blue in the face cos we're just going the wrong way in terms of the image we're putting across.
According to the bbc/a public witness a taxi driver and even a police horse was attacked yesterday.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4652027.stm I mean, what the hell are you doing? How is anyone going to even listen to our cause let alone find out about it, understand and even support it, when this happens. I understand the nature and bias of the mainstream media but this information is from a bystander. For God's sake we're getting ahead of ourselves. The average person doesn't have a clue what anarchism is or what it stands for, they think we're a bunch of extremist yobs! They happily (now, thanks to actions like yesterday) lump us in with football hooligans and religious extremists. They do not know we're doing these things in support of THEM and that we want THEM to join us in the struggle. We're totally alienating the people we need to help us. And if this movement is to get anywhere we should educate first and act later. My girlfriend of nearly two years doesn't even understand anarchism, and I can't explain it without being patronising of shoving it down her throat. I defended the 'idiots' on TV but now I don't think I should anymore. I'm fed up with people being so irresponsible. May Day is now a farce, all I see is crusties in dreadlocks drinking carlsberg special brew grunting "f*ck the police" (I'm in a library so I had to censor the swearing). What the hell is it with dreadlocks and sandals? Anarchism is a highly sophisticated political ideology, this fails to get through... we need office workers, builders, mechanics etc. These are real working class people. The general public accume all anti-capitalists are hippies on the dole or students and so get us every time with their "get a job" quips.
We need to make them realise this is for their benefit, their destiny, their world. I say 'their', I mean 'our' of course. But right now joe public is alienated, confused, amused and angry at the idea of anarchism or libertarian socialism and it's the most frustrating thing. We need to change and take it one step at a time. Educate then act, not act like a tw*t and expect others to sympathise... attacking taxi drivers, digging up flower beds, having a go at a horse... what the hell?! We should act in self defence only and only use physical action when we need to push though a police line, which we can if we all act at once together if there is many of us. They can't arrest us all if we keep sharp and moving.
Maybe a good tactic is to dress up as big teddy bears and fluffy animals for some direct action. How would that look on TV, police beating up a big furry bear.
Sorry this is more of a rant but I wanted to get these thoughts out, I hope I wasn't patronising and sorry about the grammar and spelling.
Thanks.
Dave the Rave
Comments
Hide the following 25 comments
in the same boat
05.07.2005 16:26
bobby spoons
Unplug yourself and you will feel better...
05.07.2005 16:40
> we're just going the wrong way in terms of the image we're putting across.
> According to the bbc/a public witness a taxi driver and even a police horse was attacked yesterday.
I have a lot of sympathy for how you feel -- If I was getting my information from the BBC, I would be depressed too! Having been in the streets of Edinburgh and seen people being penned in for hours on end with any reason, and local kids mostly chasing the police because they nicked their mates, I feel much better about it. Corporate and State Media are scum, and they lie for a living: the images they project can only serve their masters! Get out in the streets to see for yourself, read indypendant media -- take the red pill and unplug yourself from the matrix!
m.
Comment
05.07.2005 16:48
The biggest problem to me is that are too many people dressing up in stupid costumes and playing with the police and not enough people willing to stand and fight.
Saying this however, I don't think these set piece tactic-less, police controlled and completely obvious 'show downs' have any value whatsoever.
We need to claim our spaces, declare our intent, and hold our ground. Build our communities and fight for all hell when they are attacked.
Instead of being led like lemmings to every political gathering why aren't we as a movement building power for ourselves and our neighbours. Working to find ways to live that rely less and less on government bodies. Whether this is anarchist schools, social centres, adult learning, reclaiming all forms of cashless existence (whether gardening squatting or whatever). These are things to be built and shared and when they are attacked they are things worthing dying and more importantly killing for.
Wearing a black mask and going to a place where you are gauranteed to be surrounded by police, where you have no chance of affecting any positive change is childish posturing.
The black bloc and the fucking clown army are flip sides of the same 'spectacle'. Pointless violence and pointless pacifism are what has basically killed off what, a few years ago, seemed like a movement.
Me
don't believe everything you read
05.07.2005 16:55
I don't doubt people get hit in the melee and the horses are likely to get hit now and then, but seriously mate, if you have never been in a situation where the pigs are repeatedly baton charging you (this, obviously, isn't reported) you don't know how scary it is and how desperate you can get.. so please don't expect perfect rationalisations from the people there.
Bear in mind there are a lot of reports of local youths going there for a ruck with the cops. the independent today had a picture of (excuse me being stereotypical) what looked like your archetypical Edinborugh 'hardman' kicking off, with the inference that this gentleman was an anarchist... now i'm all for the locals going and giving the cops some, but you can't really expect them to be able to behave within some thought through intellectual framework, when all they really want to do it give it back to the cops for all the times them and their mates have been treated like filth by the filth..
There are a lot of us out here doing good things, winning people over. but it can only be done one person at a time.. if you are expecting some inspiration from the BBC, your in the wrong place, your reaction is exactly what they are looking to instill. seriously, live out your anarchism as an example to all, don't expect the BBC to do the propagandising!!
anon
Corporate media
05.07.2005 17:00
another anarchist
bang on me
05.07.2005 17:00
looking forward to a bright future for all!
anon (again)
Out fox 'em!
05.07.2005 17:03
Perhaps, they should dress up as foxes, and that'll get the surburban 4x4 drivers on side.. on second thoughts it'll only attract the attention of tweed wearing new-monies.
But seriously, I have nothing against people defending themselves and have been at enough protests to know that sometimes the coppers MUST be following orders to effectively inflame the situation.
But on the other hand, some people are just handing it the media on plate by acting like yobs. Perhaps the the situation *is* largely the work of "agent provocateurs" perhaps not, at any rate perhaps there should be a zero tolerance to violence on the PROTESTORS' side of things! If a protest is boxed in, monitors should ask everyone to sit down?
The police wouldn't have an excuse to put the boot in if protestors were to deal with the numpties promptly themselves! The media would then have nothing to report that will fit a Daily Mail editorial.
Pro Hunt
where were you then?!
05.07.2005 17:04
Jessica
e-mail:
jessicahealy2004@yahoo.co.uk
agreed!
05.07.2005 17:15
PaulB
Just sit down
05.07.2005 18:04
Pretty much exactly what happened in Canning Street yesterday. Once the police pulled back and gave us some room to breath, as opposed to being herded together like cattle, the atmosphere became fairly peaceful and relaxed. Those elements who were considering violence (manuovering wheelie bins toward the police lines) were dissuaded by the other protestors (mostly by a simple total lack of support).
A big thanks to the legal observers for helping to calm the situation yesterday.
In spite of some media reports, Canning St was a very peaceful protest. No injuries that I was aware of.
Once everyone is sitting/lying down, it doesn't look vey good if the police charge, just so long as the cameras are still there...
in canning st
media
05.07.2005 18:24
My point is we shouldn't give them the ammuntion they use against us. If anyone like the locals who just wanted to have a ruck starts acting stupid we should reign them in or distance ourselves from them. Isn't that what it's all about, taking responsibility?
I agree with coments about community totally, I guess my post was mainly referring to those that are there... I would like to be but ironically I can't afford the trip.
So yeah.
P.S I still stand by the fluffy animals tactic.
Dave the Rave
Worth thinking about the whole picture
05.07.2005 19:40
The great strength of anarchism is its ability to encompass all these elements under the same banner. We have our disagreements, and sometimes these will be angry and explosive. Yet if we didn't have such differing approaches and emphasis, or if we sought to dismiss/ purge those who deviated from our own perspective of 'correct thinking', then we would be no better than the most doctrinaire of Marxists. There is room for everyone under the anarchist umbrella, and if you disagree with an action or a tactic, then you don't have to 'justify' or 'defend' it. You should have enough conviction in your own version of anarchism to be able to smile (or frown, if you will) at the clowns or black blocs, critique with feeling if you feel the need, then get on with pursuing your own priority agenda.
The tactics dominating at this G8 protests and actions may indeed be found wanting. Or they may yet to prove to be surprisingly effective - the end result remains to be seen. Be open to surprise! Emma Goldman went through several profound learning transformations in her revolutionary career, and yet she remained a committed and stalwart anarchist throughout.
Remember that 'revolution is the carnival of the oppressed' - as James Connolly said (the Edinburgh born syndicalist, whose name has been misappropriated by Marxists and Irish Republicans alike).
Terrordaktyl
stay in your armchair then
05.07.2005 20:47
From where u can continue to feel like a real member of the public.
x
and another thing
05.07.2005 20:58
Very few people will say that violence is NEVER justified, but like all actions it has to be proportional and in so in context. I refuse to believe that holding a demo in a comparatively free country necessitates bodily harm and destruction of property. This isn't Sierra Leone or Raffa or Revolutionary Spain or 1968! The justifications for violence I have read on IM today strike me as using one type of situation to justify another. Apart from that it, it is a little incredible to demand respect and not give any back!
I can understand people's assertion of their right to protest without the permission of the state, but on the other in the context of a situation where they know fine well local politicians will not wish to be seen to be weak, it's a bit of an own goal to NOT cooperate with the authorities at *some* level. Furthermore, if they are trying to re-educate people, to persuade people to join them in changing things, then making a public statement that supporting their cause equals committing crime and getting your head kicked in the back of a TSG van isn't exactly a good strategy.
In other words: if you want people to listen to you, don't act like an arse! Democracy is about inclusion and listening, not about bullying or preaching.
I suppose the good thing is, that the "Black Bloc" agenda will by its nature never get anywhere! The bad thing is they latch onto to very serious people and use them as human shields. Which last time I looked was cowardice rather than heroism.
James Hunt
e-mail:
prinzerle@hotmail.com
Come the revolution
05.07.2005 21:11
1) the thing is, since the may day demos of 2000, the police presence at any "anti-capitalist" demos has been completely disproportionate to the number of protestors present.
in 2001, for example, there were 6000 protestors and over 10 000 police. By 2003, the may-day demos had effectively petered out because the police just swamped them. It seems that this is a tactic that the police (and of course, the state) have employed at edinburgh. Time and again it has been noted (even in teh mainstraem press, i notice) that the police presence is just over-whelming. "Heavy-handed", "over-reacting", choose your term. The point is that this means people are either gonna b more and more put off attending demos (which of course is the point, from teh state's point of view), or the merest sight of trouble is gonna b leapt on and squashed immediately. Its very disappointing and i think this tactic that teh state has employed since the hey-day of 2000, is a contributory factor towards the decline of the effectiveness of the anti-capitalist movement in this country. I don't know the solution. i think the problem is only gonna get worse. It has come to something, for sure, when the state feels so threatened by a loud but still small minority of the population voicing opposition, that it has to completely overeact like this and stamp it out through suc ridiculous levels of over-policing.
So, what now. well, the clowns is one way, whatever is said here, because ultimately any revolutionary history buff will tell u, violence only begats violence. Lenin saw that and never resolved the problem. he was the hope. When Stalin triumphed in the succesion, it was too late.
The whole place of violence to further the cause is very much up for debate, i know. It brings attention, but is all publicity good publicity? The Live8 whatever, definitely helped bring issues to the wider public consciousness, even if some of the criticism's of it were valid. And, here's a question to throw out to u all? What if the electoral system is reforemd and they do bring in a more inclusive system, where smaller parties could thrive and actually get 10, 20, 50 mp's elected. Should the anti-capitalist/globalist movement form a party and take part? move away from the direct actions, which seem to b less and less effective because of what i've said above. Its a thought, people. Revolutionary movements (however one defines this) have had to face this challenge before. Within 5-10 years we will have to do the same, i predict.
G
e-mail:
grahamac@hotmail.com
Homepage:
http://www.universaltaxi.co.uk
stay in your armchair then
05.07.2005 21:57
y
Still it does clarify some things though
05.07.2005 22:58
You get all these "disillusioned" liberal "anarchists" on indymedia endlessly explaining to each other how the media is BAD and TELLS LIES, and other shocking things, and then they get a bit of negative coverage about something they associate themselves with, and they can't swallow it quick enough, and start moaning about people causing trouble like a fucking Daily Mail reader.
If a really serious fight between workers and bosses ever breaks out in this country, could you lot do everyone a favour and stay the fuck at home.
kno
It wiznae me mister! A big boy did it and ran away!!!
06.07.2005 08:17
There *are* exagerrations in the media. There always has been and there always will be. It's written by talking apes just like you and me with their own agendas. But if you have been paying attention for the last 5 years you may have noticed a definite swing in the media attitude (in this country at least) that is making things difficult for politicians.
It is getting a bit tiresome to hear the same old excuses trotted out decade after decade. The simple truth of the matter is that people turn up to demos and start trouble and join in when trouble is started and I *know* fine well that it can't always be "someone else's fault"
You dreams of a revolution where the workers fight the bosses is unlikely to happen... and especially so if you don't ASK the workers what THEY want and appear only to offer them a punch up, a cosh on the skull and a fine. And talk to them in a language the "people" understand. People don't give a crap about dogma, they want a better a life: better housing, better wages, better policing, better health care! And I have to admit given that the cost of repairing roads and public proprerty and policing and mending people's head injuries comes out the public purse, I fail to see the sense in causing trouble.
A lot of the "people" are deeply dissatisfied with the status quo but very few of them will see anything positive in "yobbish culture".
People like you sneer at people who try to implement change. If MI5 & Special Branch ARE behind starting trouble to keep people with your attitude on the periphery, then all I can say is good on them! That doesn't make me any less of an anarchist; I'd rather have that than live in a war zone!
Maybe I have been harsh in judging your ilk and invite you to illustrate how you think you can turn a situation of great social injustice around by turning up in communities and breaking things? What's the Big Plan?
"If a really serious fight between workers and bosses ever breaks out in this country, could you lot do everyone a favour and stay the fuck at home."
Trust me, if there is a revolution I'll be armed... and after people like you, because you are a worse proposition than what we already have. Try going to a war zone before you start talking romantically about carnage! THEN you may rethink your "ideals"
The Hunt for Red Oktober
Turn off!
06.07.2005 08:40
I would've thought you'd be trying to encourage others and win over Socialist minds like mine
who've become disallusioned with politicians of every shade of gravy !---
Personally I feel more drawn to Daves philosophy than some of the more ugly bastard
vitriol spewing out of this site-------my dog would'nt take a biscuit from you.
kelly
workers versus bosses
06.07.2005 17:10
At least that would be a clear-cut situation, wouldn't it? - time to take sides. One side will be the people who have what is historically one of the richest lifestyles the planet has even seen, with DVD players, a car, mobile phones, computers, enough to eat, no worries about a roof over their heads, foreign holidays, and generally loadastuff - some would say all this has been acquired unfairly by exploiting really poor workers in other countries. And then the other side will be.....the bosses, who have all that and more. Perhaps they could arrange to fight in Majorca, or Ibiza - where are we all going this year? Disneyworld, even -that would be good.
I know not everyone in this country fits that description, but the vast majority do - and those at the bottom of the heap who are living on the street tend to be too pissed or doped-out to attend political consciousness-raising events - still we can always blame them for causing any trouble we have to admit took place on a demo, it was those local ruffians (i.e. some of the people who actually live in the place). Surprising that the organised working class, through the trade unions, has not quite managed to do much for their unemployed or low-paid brothers and sisters. They did have the chance in the 1970's, after all.
It's all a bit more complex than class war these days.....
PaulB
Like I was saying ...
06.07.2005 18:26
kno
Nature of proof?
06.07.2005 18:47
Er.. let me work that out, as you haven't shown your working out. So don't get wound up if I've misunderstood!
Do you mean that because I question a strict fundamentalist Christian view, I am therefore a pagan and emissary of the devil, and therefore my views can be ignored and are in fact heretical? Sorry, wrong possible closed-mindset. Try again, do you mean that because I question a strict class analysis and its relevance in 2005, I am by definition a liberal, and probably a middle-class wanker as well (it's cool to swear, I see - saves using too many words and actually engagin in debate), and therefore my views can safely be ignored?
PaulB
ad nauseum
06.07.2005 20:10
I invite you once more to edify us all:
"Maybe I have been harsh in judging your ilk and invite you to illustrate how you think you can turn a situation of great social injustice around by turning up in communities and breaking things? What's the Big Plan?"
Hunt the Numpty
Re-read your own post Paul
06.07.2005 21:29
Except for the helpless poor. Who you don't resent so much, precisely because they are helpless and poor, which is how you prefer them, cos you aren't looking for people to fight alongside, you are looking for people on whose behalf you can moralise. (Best of all if they're not only poor and helpless, but far away.)
I.e. you're a classic liberal.
As for the idiot who thinks he's detected " a definite swing in the media attitude (in this country at least) that is making things difficult for politicians" - and who would like to come "armed" after "people like me", whoever his fuckwitted idea of that is - where do you start?
kno
ad libitum
07.07.2005 08:28
Hmm, guess it should be YOU that should do the the re-reading: I never said I would "like" to go after anyone armed; but if push came to shove I certainly wouldn't be siding with the people who thought violence was the FIRST port of call in persuasion and social order: i.e. repressors, bullies, cowards.
If YOU wish to wear the dunce cap rather than provide an explanation of your beliefs then so be it.
I happen to think there is a lot of truth in what Paul says. But I'll go one step further and ask how much contact you have had with these people you are "fighting alongside". Have you been to your local social toilet (housing estates/slums) and asked people what they want? Cheaper shellsuits, better ringtones and stronger cider perhaps?
I predict that if you went to Westerhales or Possil or Peckham or Mosside etc etc etc and started spouting off at them you will leave in an ambulance looking like a panda.. if you were lucky. If anyone is being condescending here it's you! I'm not saying their problems aren't serious; Just that you aren't speaking FOR them. Christ, you aren't even speaking WITH them! You are merely using them to excuse your own behaviour.
I think there is a valid distinction to be made between the social situation here and those of "far away": Can we really equate OUR social problems to those of Palestine, Chechnya, Sierra Leonne, Anywherestan etc.? That is NOT saying "there are worse places in the world, so belt up!". It is saying "get things in perspective!"
I am curious at how you bandy the word "liberal" as a pejorative. My understanding of it roughly adheres to
I am still genuinely interested in how violence and vandalism will translate into social change!
I think someone put it all som much more elequlently earlier: my dog would'nt take a biscuit from you!
I'll borrow that one: My organic, endangered breed chickens wouldn't crap on your leg!
Old Berhshire Hunt