police murdered unarmed suspect in tube shooting
ebn | 22.07.2005 14:35 | London
Worst fears come true. Killer cops shot dead an asin man this morning execution style after following him from his home and allowing him to enter a tube train full of passengers before tackling him to the ground then firing five bullets into his head at point blank range.
Early speculation was that the man had a bomb under his jacket but it has now been confirmed that he was completely unarmed. While some of the media is saying the man look suspcious because of his jacket, anyone who was out this morning will know that it is actually rather chilly.
This man should have been stopped and arrested in the street is he was suspected of being a bomber, not allowed to enter the tube and killed while restrained by cops.
Early speculation was that the man had a bomb under his jacket but it has now been confirmed that he was completely unarmed. While some of the media is saying the man look suspcious because of his jacket, anyone who was out this morning will know that it is actually rather chilly.
This man should have been stopped and arrested in the street is he was suspected of being a bomber, not allowed to enter the tube and killed while restrained by cops.
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/050722/140/fny0z.html Tailing The Tube Suicide Bomb Suspect
Specialist officers had been tailing the man shot at Stockwell Tube station from his home, says Sky News Crime Correspondent Martin Brunt.Police believed the Asian man was responsible for an attempted attack on the nearby Oval Tube on Thursday and had set up surveillance on him.Brunt said officers had followed the man from his home and that the initial plan was to arrest him.
But from his home to Stockwell Tube, events overtook police and marksmen were forced to shoot.
Despite temperatures of around 22C (72F), officers and witnesses said the man was wearing a heavy coat under which it was feared may have been a bomb.
Brunt said: "Intelligence officers had suggested he was the bomber from Thursday.
"Officers were confronted with the very real possibility that this man did have a bomb."
Initial examinations though, said Brunt, did not discover any explosives on the suspect.
ebn
Comments
Hide the following 62 comments
oops, sorry
22.07.2005 15:04
at least explains some of the recent "explosions"
not yet radicalised
fashion victim
22.07.2005 15:09
"Did not respond to challenges.."
Perhaps non English speaking and cold.
maybe safer to go naked on tube.
alf garnet
truth
22.07.2005 15:14
"The man fought his way up the railway carrage, he stopped when he saw a mother with a child about 2 strapped in a buggy, he grinned at them and sat down opposite, then he shouted some words in Arabic and his rucksack blew open, he panicked and ran away chased by 2 men, he appeared to target the child, the carrage was much fuller next door"
If I ever meet the police officer who shot him, I will carry him on my shoulders and shout, make way for a true hero ! for one thing he has done is to stop this ba$tard ever trying it again
truth
USUK massacre in Fallujah
22.07.2005 15:39
The cycle of violence that Bliar unleashed will be less easy to stop than his idiotic rhetoric and Bushist poodling started .
We need to pray, make true.. that simple minded fundamentalists such as Bliar are never elected again and work towards a proper democracy with proportional representstion by all peaceful, non-violent means.
We must pray that results of Bliar's violence does not further hurt anyone.
nein kampf
Israeli/Mossad officers?
22.07.2005 15:41
AJ
"truth", my arse
22.07.2005 15:49
I hope you hurt your back carrying this murdering copper about.
Babe Ruth
Fair & Balanced
22.07.2005 15:51
Even at 15:30 when this was posted a number of witnesses had already come forward to say that the man was running away from armed police.
Sir.Muttley
Still looking for an answer
22.07.2005 15:55
That is precisely what he said.
Was the individual also involved in yesterday's attacks?
Alec
What about Innocent until proven guilty
22.07.2005 16:16
Of course the fact that some young guys recently blew themselves and a whole load of other innocent folks up on London Transport (remember them) obviously gives the cops the right to shoot dead on sight any poor fucker who happens looks like a suicide bomber.
I guess that makes anyone with dark skin an a ruck sack a dead duck, not a problem for me being tall white with blonde hair. World famous (so they say) British Justice now takes a another serious dive into the sewer and more innocent people are likely to be gunned down.
As I under stand it cops were only allowed to shoot people if they were actually threatened.
Surely it would be fair play to put up posters with "yer typical suicide bomber" on them so at least you could say "he was warned". Terrorism has come along way since Bushit and Bliar started on their Phoney war on terror. Lots of innocent people have died, mainly in Afghanistan and Iraq but I guess it's still earlier days and there is lot's more money in it for their corporate masters and a few more train loads will die ..
Miss Print
Re: Israeli/Mossad
22.07.2005 16:17
FFS, what is it with this mania for spreading rumours about Mossad/Israel/Jews? You don't think our own police are capable of shooting someone? Or doesn't that fit with your favourite conspiracy theories?
Jack Straw
in the words of a eyewitness
22.07.2005 16:31
they pushed him to the floor and basically unloaded 5 shots
into him i saw i saw i saw the gun being fired 5 times into the guy"
transcribed from the eyewitness FIRST description to bbc over the phone
ben
Lets get this straight
22.07.2005 16:42
Police say he was followed from his home.
WHY WAS HE ALLOWED TO GET INTO THE STATION IF THEY THOUGHT HE HAD A BOMB!?
What we are talking about is the murder of an unarmed man who may have been able to provide information valuable to the investigation.
WHY DID HIE NEED TO DIE?
How the hell are we meant to shut down this terror network if we kill the suspects without questioning them first?
This is murder - racially motivated it seems - plain and simple.
copper
zzz
22.07.2005 16:54
"Police assisted the suicide bomber! Why didn't the shoot! blah blah blah!"
Pfff
magoo
Magoo
22.07.2005 17:33
Don't you see that the word 'supect' is not the same as the words 'convicted terrorist', (which still does not warrant the death penalty in this country). By allowing the police to be judge, jury and executioner, we take one more step towards becoming a police state. We are kept in fear and compliance by the police's actions, as much as by the bombings.
observer
funny
22.07.2005 17:44
It is surely very healthy for Islamic radicals in the UK to understand that if they percieve the UK as Darul Harb (land of war) it can cut both ways.
bp
What irrational nonsense
22.07.2005 17:45
I doubt he would have been able to run fast enough with his paunch. It was actually Col. Jorge Mendonca.
THUS SPAKE MISS PRINT ==> Pretty sick that there always seems to bbe someone who is over the moon
And they are not in this thread.
==> Of course the fact that some young guys recently blew themselves and a whole load of other innocent folks up on London Transport (remember them)
What the ferkin L is that supposed to mean?
==> obviously gives the cops the right to shoot dead on sight any poor fucker who happens looks like a suicide bomber.
I thought you were wavering on the edge of lunacy before, but you have just jumped right on in. At no point has the like of Magoo or myself or whomever said that. What we have ridiculed is those half-wits who immediately branded the police or S.B.S. as murderers; and merely adjusted their perception of events, but not the basic accusation, as more clear reports come in. Magoo is perfectly right about these pillocks. Had the individual not been shot, and proceeded to turn a load of commuters into charcoal sticks, they would be the first to sign up to Poisonplanet's rants about government-sponsored terrorism.
The Army or the police are always in demand when we are in danger, but often loathed at other times.
THUS SPAKE COPPER ==> The murdered man is NOT one of the four men wanted for questioning in relation to thursdays attempted bombings.
Just as with Miss Print's sly accusations, that is true but complete irrelevant. When is someone going to answer my questions. Has the dead man been linked to yesterday's attacks? If no-one answers, I will shream and shream funtil I make myhelff fick.
==> How the hell are we meant to shut down this terror network if we kill the suspects without questioning them first?
Answer me this. How many other police raids have been conducted today, and within the past fortnight? How many of them were conducted against brown-skinned individuals? Finally, how many fatal shootings have there been?
Consider it, and then reconsider this remark.
==> This is murder - racially motivated it seems - plain and simple.
You are the biggest cretin in Christendom. I have not felt this het up since Vanessa Redgrave spouted gibberish after Beslan.
==> WHY DID HIE NEED TO DIE?
Exactly. They must have had a bloody good reason not to 'cuff him and then treat him as a human punch-bag in the police-van.
Alec
The point is
22.07.2005 17:50
Death to Zion.
Anti-fascist
Troll Magoo
22.07.2005 17:50
anarchoteapot
More Questions
22.07.2005 18:00
Perhaps he was the fall guy?
Mossad, CIA?
Ah but
22.07.2005 18:02
Paranoid Pete
Don't you....
22.07.2005 18:31
Lets wait for some more information before jumping to any conclusions, lads.
Big Bad Boab
in two minds
22.07.2005 18:35
However, i don't like shoot to kill policies - very dogy teritory always, especially if the guy is doing nothing wrong. But can you imaging the uproar if he had managed to blow himself up with 5 officers on top of him, killing them and all the other passenger in the train as well?
You do gotta wonder though why they let him get as far as they did if they did think he was a bomber.
purple
what do we know? (all together now!):
22.07.2005 19:05
_____
There's that's how a proper "troll" would start a post.
____
Anyway, none of you do ANY research? There are dozens of witnesses stating the guy was pursued down a busy high st. You think it would be prudent to shout "Stop! Armed police!" if there was the slightest chance the guy was trussed up with explosives? If you do, I'm glad we have masons protecting us and not you lot!
Nextly: no-one here knows anything about the operational details. Did they even know where the guy lived? Was he lured into a trap? Were they triangulating a postion from the mobile network? Was he simply tailed? What intelligence did they have on him? You DON'T know!
Whose operation was it? Who did the shooting (MI5/S019/SAS etc)? Again, you DON'T know!
Did something go against plan in the operation? You don't know!
So, basically you know FUCK ALL! Please bear that in mind before you go knitting conspiracy out of tosh!
______
Now get back to smoking yer soapbar and supporting international terrorism you bunch of hypocrites.
____
And that's how a proper troll'd end a post. Note the subtle difference in style...
magoo
Survival tips
22.07.2005 19:06
No, I would French-kiss the pavement.
THUS SPAKE PARANOID PETE ==> I'm with Magoo here.
What you get up to in your own time if of no interest to me.
Alec
Alec
22.07.2005 19:10
magoo
Stop and search
22.07.2005 19:31
Isn't it ironic that the cops want new powers to stop and search, and yet when they have a suspect they *ought* to search, they simply shoot him?
Isn't it true that the last, tenuous, reason left why we ought to have some respect for the cops after the repression at the G8 is that it is their job to risk their life if necessary stopping precisely such a suspect?
But do they? Do they fuck. They shoot first and ask questions later.
citizen
...
22.07.2005 19:33
Anyone who has ever had a gun pointed at them with nowhere to hide would know this concept. It's called "I don't want to die!!!"
magoo
4 Alec
22.07.2005 19:43
The fact that four young guys decided to blow themselves up on the tube / bus horrific as it may be should not give the cops the right to gun down unarmed persons on the underground network.
If they were so worried about the safety of the passengers why did they not shoot him out on the street ?
or maybe on the escalators ...
Miss Print
so where does it go?
22.07.2005 19:52
so where does this thing go?
Wretchards' comments for those of you who have never seen them:-
bp
Don't Fall for the PsyOps !
22.07.2005 20:25
Mind you, his postings always get deleted so we'll be spared them soon. Love his suggestion I'm Magoo. And Boab. Cos we are all anti-conspiracy. Hmm. Great thinking.
Paranoid Pete
Don't Fall for the PsyOps
22.07.2005 20:30
magoo
what we all hope it was not
22.07.2005 20:42
amilcar
my final word on this sad state of affairs
22.07.2005 20:56
To the prisonplanet.com crew. Go visit the Middle East and get a grip!
magoo
Moomin is missing his trolls
22.07.2005 20:59
THUS SPAKE MISS PRINT ==> London Transport, as it was once known was Londons own Transport system before the tories sold it off to themselves, at that time the big building opposite the HP now occupied by Charles Saatchi's art gallery and a giant size fish tank was called county hall. Saatchi and co were Thatchers PR company.
I get you. I misunderstunk.
==> The fact that four young guys decided to blow themselves up on the tube / bus horrific as it may be should not give the cops the right to gun down unarmed persons on the underground network.
You are perfectly correct. Of course, I do not think this was a premeditated killing, but rather one caused by the exigencies of the moment.
==> If they were so worried about the safety of the passengers why did they not shoot him out on the street ? or maybe on the escalators ...
I have been asking myself the same question. I am inclined to think this was a surveillance operation which very almost went hideously wrong. For whatever reason, sight of the suspect was lost when above ground. When it was realized he had gone down below, bowels opened and there was a scramble to find him.
Questions should indeed to be asked as to why he was allowed to get underground. This is not, however, it does not necessarily follow that it is unjustified to shoot a suspected suicide bomber.
What else? Oh yes. O-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-aaaaaaah, ho-ho-ho-ho, hnugh ha ha hnurgh hnurgh. That is the closest representation of my response to Don’t_Fall’s post.
Alec
nein kampf
22.07.2005 21:00
magoo
Paranoid Pete, Alec, Boab
22.07.2005 21:02
magoo
Hey Magoo
22.07.2005 21:05
Maybe we should stop agreeing, just on principle. Do you want to be the crazed conspiracy nutter quoting PrisonPlanet and WhatReallyHappened as "facts" or "evidence", or is it my go?
PP
Paranoid Pete
'Man shot dead was not a bomber'
22.07.2005 21:26
'Man shot dead was not a bomber'
Saturday July 23 2005 00:00 IST
Reuters
LONDON: A man shot dead by police at a London Underground station on Friday was not one of the four bombers who tried to attack the city's transport system on Thursday, Sky Television reported citing security sources.
"This is what I am picking up from security sources that the man who was shot this (Friday) morning at Stockwell tube wasn't one of those four bombers that police are hunting," Sky reporter Martin Brunt said.
A spokesman for London's Metropolitan Police said only: "the gentleman shot at Stockwell today has yet to be identified, so it would be impossible to link him to anything at this stage."
Police shot the man a day after four attempted bomb attacks in London and 15 days after bombers killed more than 50 people in the British capital.
Police said the shooting was part of an operation directly linked to an "anti-terrorist" probe.
They said they were still looking for four men in connection with Thursday's attacks, which caused chaos but killed no one.
Police seeking London bombers shoot man dead
various
Paranoid Pete
22.07.2005 21:45
Okay. I'll salute rank and obey!
magoo
Magoo smells of poo. Who's washing magoo's pants tomorrow?
22.07.2005 21:54
Everyone knows Alistair Campboy has pictures of Cpt. Scarlett pleasuring the CEO of Monsanto.The so-called terrorists bought their ricksacks from Blacks. That just goes to show that it's a jewish conspiracy since Black is a Jewish name but Milets is Aryan.
Man, only the total bringdown sqaures wouldn't clock the toal clambake that MI5 did today daddio. They slotted a brother with no other evidence other than a chav tailor daddio!
Aled Jones says the snowman brings bad weather and that guy on robot wars saw arial sharon smuggling mossad into Luton in his jowls.
N Any nmfo dat ain't hep to the buzz is just gone bro. Jez plain gone, dig?
httpees:www.anker.com/monkeyrulestheuniverse/truth
pintos paranoid smythe
death to fascists
22.07.2005 22:36
this man was silenced
plain and simple
pat brown
No! I'm Brian!
22.07.2005 22:37
And I artaud am also just another pseudo of this Paranoid-Magoo-Boab being...
artaud
Shhh!
22.07.2005 22:41
What, for goodness sake? Deaths have taken place in custody before. Following your line of reasoning, why shoot him when they could drag him away for further grilling and a good beating?
Alec
atsa la vista cabron!
22.07.2005 22:52
The rest of you can suck my baldy maggit!
magoo
You talking to me?
22.07.2005 23:05
Alec
Frightening to see all the racist comments,
23.07.2005 00:48
"Alec", "magoo", "artaud" show such a lack of compassion in their gleeful
hatespeech putting themselves beyond contempt.
Despicable.
someone somewhere
How to please the Blairs..
23.07.2005 07:46
Observer
Ach Haud Yer Wheesht
23.07.2005 08:31
As opposed to other correspondents who show a gleeful predisposition based on few, if any, facts to paint the police as a bunch of homicidal maniacs.
Get oot mair, mate.
Paranoid Pete
tiresome
23.07.2005 09:04
So, how does that square with my POTENTIAL support of the killing (see Journalism 101 and what the connotations of "slaying" are)? Well, in the real world of security there are times when you have to weigh up possibilities in light of remit to protect the public.
No-one here knows why the guy was shot. All I am stating is that if there was the slightest chance the guy was bringing inocent life into danger then all I can say is "Job well done!" I'm sure the police et al would much rather have the guy in Paddington Green for a grilling.
Which segues neatly onto "unity".
I find it rather tiresome that some people think that to be an anarchist you have to be anti police, anti army, anti security anti everything. Personally I consider people who interpret 'anarchy' as meaning 'no rules' are either looking for an excuse to abandone their social responsibilities, or are really nihilist and don't realise it, or are just thick.
If you want no rules, go to Chechnya, Somalio, Sierra Leone, Syria etc etc etc and then come back and tell us all that the "filth" are just "facists"... "man"
There can never be any "unity" (in it's purest sense) between those who seek a truly democratic social structure and those who seek chaos.
After all, this is what IndyMedia is all about. The people decide what the news is and what it means. You get the IM you deserve...
BTW I can't be racist my pufferfish comes from Africa! ;-) But seriously, I couldn't care less what colour the guy's skin was. If he was a threat, it's regrettable but sometimes necessary to kill to protect.
magoo
Shoot to kill
23.07.2005 10:21
John
When IM watching yooo,oooo,oo. Magoo is boring me.
23.07.2005 11:33
I've just been reading the thread about Friday's shooting which yourself, Paranoid Prat, and Wee Willy Winky were kind enough to scribble on. What an Interesting debate it was too, especially with the benefit of hindsight, which you seem to be as blind to as foresight. You were however kind enough to try and define anarchy in the vague manner of stating what does not constitute anarchy... couple of days late though, wouldn't you agree?
Riddle me this Clever Clogs...
If you are, as you state, 100% against the death penalty and summary justice then you can have zero potential for supporting the Judge Dredd 2000AD action on Friday 22/07/2005.
If you have potential support for this on the grounds of relative morality and begin to argue ethics applied to a 'real world' situation... i.e. he may have been armed with explosives theoretically threatening multiple lives, therefore he had to be executed in order to eliminate this potential (no matter how likely) before any evidence was sought... "The needs of the many outweigh the rights of the individual" Then you are not 100% against the death penalty and summary execution. You certainly are not seeking a “truly democratic social structure” if you have the potential to think "Job well done!" in regards to a state action which falls this far outside the agreed principles of democracy.
Either one or both of the statements are untrue, making you a liar who bends facts, picks and chooses whichever belief system fits the moment and has an egotistical need to be right. Or a more worrying and more likely explanation is that you carry dichotomies easily in your head with regards to your world view model, evidence of multiple personality disorder, schizophrenia or some other form of mental illness.
I'm only telling you this because I'm concerned that you may become a danger to yourself and society in general. Recently legislation, in the area of mental health and cognitive ability, has stated that some forms of mental illness, particularly political paranoia/schizophrenia are contagious through verbal communication. You may be sectioned under this legislation for your continuous and contradictory posts on Indymedia, which would constitute a public health hazard if other readers started to believe these two fully exclusive points of view that you hold as being true in your article.
Kisses!
A dog without a collar.
Pseudo intellectual middle-class student gobbledegook
23.07.2005 12:28
John
I see the light!
23.07.2005 13:17
Puleeease.....
Magoo, Boab, myself, Artuad, and so on have done no more than question the unsupported and frankly incredible (in the proper sense of the word) accusations of some of the worst commentators; to offer alternative suggestions, and to ask what you evidence is. And the best that can normally be mustered against us? Foul mouthed tirades and suggestions that we're all one person (after all, how many Jocks can there be, eh?)
Get oot mair mate.
Paranoid Pete
...
23.07.2005 14:01
magoo
Where?
23.07.2005 16:07
hatespeech putting themselves beyond contempt.
What an Orcadian village. Gleeful would be crowing over his death, which I am not. Gleeful would be would be talking of terrorists lacking in basic decency, which I am not. Gleeful would be reducing vast populations in the world to something less than human, which I am not. Get a grip.
Alec
Conspirators
23.07.2005 16:23
For example, I never paid much heed to the 9/11 conspiracy theorists until I read a scientific report concerning the phyiscs of the collapsing towers and the suggestion that there may have been a controlled demolition. Now I am still unsure as to what really happened, but this scientifically argued text did at least make me question the accepted line.
But when we are insultingly told to shut our traps, and our douvts rudely dismissed, then I am left wondering who the real fascists are?
artaud
truth: so long for your hero!
23.07.2005 16:28
So long for the heroes. Dedicated to "truth" and all those like him/her.
ben
...
23.07.2005 16:33
This was not murder, that implies premeditation. This was a complete an utter, unmitigated fuck-up.
Alec
Magoo, how could you?
23.07.2005 23:04
Paranoid Prat, I'll play with you soon enough, wait your turn please.
ArseTURD, I thought I told you to shut your hole, I am not usually so direct and rude without good reason and no it's not because I've been hung over for a few days or that my shoes are just too tight. Please don't be so arrogant as to group yourself in with Magoo, Pete and BBB they are in a different league altogether. Fascists would not tell you to be silent, they would ensure you could not be heard (or is that herd? I forget). I very much doubt that you have the vaguest notion how to define fascism. Perhaps you should do some research before you start trying to communicate with other humans, no? If you do have doubts as to why only three steel multi storey buildings have collapsed due to fire in over a century of their construction, all in the space of 24hrs, all owned by the same ugly little man, may I heartly recommend 'Multi Storey Buildings in Steel' by Hart, Henn and Sontag published in Great Britain 1978 by Crosby Lockwood Staples. This book contains full construction details of the two most prominent of these buildings and although it is a second-hand source it lists the publications from which this information was sourced, which would constitute a first-hand source, would it not? (it also has big pictures to make it easy to understand)You can then, at leisure, directly compare the 1978 published construction details to those published more recently after demolition day in the FEMA report and various televised 'scientific' documentaries on why the twiddlers collapsed which also constitute first-hand sources(of bullshit, smoke and mirrors). Of course if you need any help with the maths, physics, equations or empirical data regarding this comparison, Victor Thorn has published a snazzy little book covering all of these aspects, called On Trial. It's writing style is a little contrived and all of the figures are imperial rather than metric, but the calculator on your computer or a few conversion websites will clear that right up for you. If you're still having problems with what to believe after all of this fine academic research then might I suggest you watch the unedited footage of the collapses over and over and over and open your fucking eyes!
A collar without a dog, A. Lexicon.
shoot now, say sorry later...
24.07.2005 08:17
This sounds like psychopath PC Plod well and truly lost it!
Five fucking shots into the head at point blank range! Was there anything left of his face? Were they sure he was really dead?
Any chance of our heroic protectors standing trial for murder or at the very least, excessive force? FAT CHANCE!!!
wj
My turn, My turn
24.07.2005 18:57
"If you do have doubts as to why only three steel multi storey buildings have collapsed due to fire in over a century of their construction" etc etc.
As it happens, mate, I'm an architect (there's a pot shot there about dreamers, if you want) and read with some humour suggestions that steel framed buildings don't collapse during fires. Funny thing is a number of my structural engineering mates at Arup's - currently designing a 60 odd storey skyscraper in the centre of Glasgow - seem quite clear on the risks too.
I'm off work with a broken leg so I read some of the 911 conspiracy sites. Best laugh I've had in ages.
Paranoid Pete
Twin Towers
25.07.2005 18:38
Long Time Reader