Time to drop fur Mook! The eyes of the movement are on you!

It was great seeing some different (non-AR) faces on the protest today. So thank you...you know who you are!

What exactly is wrong with vintage fur? Surely recycling is a good idea.

It's second hand, no money is entering the hands of breeders or fur farmers. Seems silly to have no problem with recycling leather coats and shoes, yet there's a huge issue when it's a rabbit or fox. Is a cow worth less than rabbit?

Aren't there better targets than the vintage fur trade?

As mentioned no money is entering the hands of breeders and producers of the current fur trade.

Vintage products and antiques were also often made by workers being denied basic rights, working in dangerous and harmful conditions; do we also need to fight these products too? Or do we accept that what is done is done, the past is gone.

For that matter as most metals are recycled endlessly, and gold in particular has gone round and round for millennia, some of the gold in modern items will have been dug by slaves. Coal powered the entire manufacturing process for centuries, miners and pit-ponies died by the thousand extracting that coal. The past is full of injustice to all animals, including human animals, the world we see around us is built on the blood, bones and suffering of the earth's past inhabitants and on the rape of the Earth itself.

Should we not recognise the environmental benefit of recycling old products, howsoever they were made and focus our efforts on fighting injustice that is happening now and trying to prevent future injustice, rather than wasting out time on what is already done.

The problem is that Vintage perpetuates the fur industry as fur becomes more acceptable and fashionable thus designers use more new fur in there collections. Some new fur is even 'laundered' via Vintage fur shops to trick consumers.

It is not a matter of an old product that is no longer produced. Instead its about perpetuating a fashion trend that begins in Vintage retailers and then leads to the sale of new items of fur. As the Vintage items become 'acceptable and fashionable' the sale of new fur rises. Today's new fur is tomorrows Vintage and the circle continues. Many Vintage retailers up and down the UK recognise this and refuse to sell fur.

We are not asking for the fur to be destroyed, many positive uses can be put to it: donations to the homeless as done by groups like PETA (as this does not perpetuate the upmarket fashion trend of using fur), donations to animal shelters to keep animals warm (after all it was their kin the fur was taken from) or used in anti-fur stunts (helping repair some of the damage done by the 'acceptable' image Vintage gives the fur trade). All we ask is it is not paraded around as a middle class fashion statement as this leads directly to the sale of new fur items.

I hope this helps answer your questions.

Short of the laundering argument you can apply nearly all the arguments for targeting vintage fur to fake fur also. Do you, likewise, think fake fur is wrong?

Leather? Vintage leather? What of that?

Fake fur (old or new) encourages designers to choose 'fake' as consumers of the fake stuff are perpetuating a demand for fake fur. The demand that is created is a demand for fake fur items. By contrast buying real fur (old or new) perpetuates a demand for real fur items – as there is limited availability of old fur this inevitably leads to the sale of new fur.

Animal Rights Cambridge, as the name suggests, is an animal rights group. We oppose the use and abuse of all animals, leather included. However because of the public feeling and specific forms of abuse in the fur industry it is tactically more effective to focus boycott and divestment style campaigns on it than on leather.

When does it become acceptable to use ivory from an elephant illegally slaughtered for its tusks. Are tusks taken 50 years ago 'ethical'?

We should all wear "vintage" ivory and "vintage" rhinoceros horn and "vintage" tortoise shell as well! It's not our fault if that leads to the sale of new poached items.

When we cut the NHS we can use the bodies of the people we don't feel like treating anymore as well - waste not want not!

Rationalisation of cruelty – I love it!

Looking around my house there are a couple of ancient things which are non vegan. There are a couple of 100 year old bone handled knives, there are decades old woolen blankets, the walls are made in part of horse hair plaster from a century ago. I could throw them into landfill, I could pass them on along with the message that these things are OK to use or I can use them until they (or I)are no more. Eventually I will inherit very old ivory ornaments and fur coats.
Wearing vintage fur perpetuates the message that fur is OK and we should be protesting against it, but we do have to ask ourselves what do we do with very long lasting items which are non vegan? We do need to think on this because people are asking quite rightly how do we deal with this stuff?There are thousands of things that will just not diminish quickly. The way I see it is that when you first become veggie/vegan is that many of us chose to wear out things like leather shoes and woolen jumpers OR give them to charity shops. Fur, ivory, bone even wool can be around longer than a normal human lifespan. The blankets I have are 45 years old (a wedding gift to my parents). Personally I think it is best to use items to some good, fur coats will probably make good dog beds or may save a life in a disaster zone. Some people use them as props on demos.
There is also the thought that if we were talking about using things why not things made out of for example Holocaust victims, is it not speciest to use non human animal products but not human ones? The simple answer is scale, the sheer enormity of animal products is overwhelming. The more complex answer is that we live in a society based on animal abuse things were made from animals because it was always thus, people were being pragmatic, the Holocaust was a horrific retrograde step and to make chairs and lampshades from human skin was to horrify, terrify and degrade other humans.There is also the argument that throwing away an old product and then going on to buy a new one is not saving lives. Every product vegan or not requires some environmental destruction i.e the diminishing of habitat for wild beings, pollution and even death.
I am interested in what people think we should do with old animal products which do not wear out quickly. I expect that most of us one day will face having to deal with the possessions of a relative which will include many non vegan things. I suppose the best thing is to give things away but is this passing the buck?

I would be interested to know what you do with the PC you use that has many products that use animal body parts and liquid/fats in the manufacture process, what about the knife and fork draw in your house? You do know that the moulds are lined with animal fats, don't you?

Loonie Lynn is at it again...