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De-Growth - the Alternative to Collapse

As oil and other commodities run out; climate and species crash - politicians keep promising more growth. It's an insane mantra of old economics. Two experts explain the new economy of "de-growth" at a conference June 3rd, 2011 in Vancouver, Canada. Conrad Schmidt, founder of the "Work Less Party", and Dr. Bill Rees, co-inventor of the ecological footprint.

Audio Ecoshock 110629 2 De-Growth - mp3 27M

Should we wait for the oil to run out? Food to run out? For collapse?

Or can we plan our way back down, through power-down, simplification, localization?

You are about to hear two speakers from the opening panel at the latest De-Growth Conference, on June 3rd 2011 in Vancouver, Canada.

Dr. Bill Rees, co-inventor of the ecological footprint concept, and Conrad Schmidt, author and film maker, founder of the Work Less Party.

Both of these men are annoying.

Professor Rees listens and looks at all the schemes offered as solutions. Then he measures the actual results. Sometimes that isn't so pleasing, especially when we had such good intentions.

Conrad Schmidt can look a paradox in the eye. Does a hybrid car really save any energy? Is cheaper alternative energy really good for the planet?

Rude questions asked and answered.

From the Radio Ecoshock show 110629 Part 2 29 min

Full show archived here (on Thursday):

http://www.ecoshock.org/eshock11.html

Alex Smith
Homepage: http://www.ecoshock.org

Comments

Hide the following 5 comments

Re-Growth - alternative to Collapse

30.06.2011 19:42

Should we wait for the oil to run out?
-give up on petrol cars -electric vehicles now!
-Argon plasma jets not aviation fuel

Food to run out?
-new food production now!
-irrigate Africa!
-sustainable fisheries
-new biotank algae production, eg.spiraliena
-Quorn like proteins
-soya rather than meat
-potatoes rather than rice

New resources NOW!
-super-ceramics not metals
-use lots of other minerals & elements
-deep sea resources
-new super "concrete"
-lazer cut stone supplies

New Electricity supplies!
-hydro
-geothermal
-space-thermal!
-wind
-tidal

More machines; Less Work Now!
-BIG 3D printers, for construction industry, shipbuilding etc.
-robot farming
-robot food processing
-japanese style robot factories

Collapse?
no thanks.

Nicola

Trolling for the Empire

01.07.2011 22:08

Nicola, clearly you haven't listened to the audio, go troll for business as usual somewhere else. Though thanks for indicating that the Empire considers these ideas dangerous enough that they need to be countered.

I'd be interested in hearing the full recordings from the de-growth conference -- the selections from the speakers in the show were really great, well worth a listen.

Chris

Stop preaching Armagedon you genocide wankers!

02.07.2011 13:43

I'm taking peak food & peak oil seriously. Are you?

Its you that is sleep walking into massive food shortages, that is going to leave Asian urban poor unable to buy food. The world needs to double its food production in the next 2 years, if that includes rubish processed food so be it. Low level hippy food production is not enough, that can only sustain one billion people, not nine billion. Africa and asia need serious help with their agriculture.

Your LPG energy policy is the least sustainable option. North sea natural gas is running out. Japan and Germany have also started imported tankers of LPG. And this will force Britian to invade Iran to get their LPG resources.

I agree with the reduction of american consumption of consumer goods. And with the reduction globally in fish eating, and meat eating.

You refuse to consider new resources and new materials, as a major option. For example cermamics may require serious amounts of Zircon from australia. New electrical motors require rare earth materials from china.

Collapse?
no thanks.

Nicola (non-troll)

Nicola: Still Trolling for the Empire

02.07.2011 14:25

> Its you that is sleep walking into massive food shortages

There is a billion people starving on the planet right now and 1.4 billion overweight -- there is enough food right now it's just not being shared out equally.

Listen to this:

Nafeez Ahmed: Food Crisis & Peak Oil (Audio)

http://sheffield.indymedia.org.uk/2008/11/413658.html

> Your LPG energy policy is the least sustainable option

I'm not responsible for the *LNG* (not P) imports, of course they are stupid but clearly you still haven't listened to the audio you are trolling.

> You refuse to consider new resources and new materials

Uh hu...

Imperial "Business as Usual" is Ecocide and Genocide -- this is what you are clearly trolling in support of.

Chris

A different future is possible

03.07.2011 11:21

You might consider industrial agriculture as Ecocide, there is some ecological impact; loss of hedgerows, wilderness, etc. BUT many places that get irrigation will have an improved ecosystem, anythings better than aridness. It will have an increase in deseil for tractors/machines.
BUT it is still better than a 2 billion genocide. Your asserion theres enough food for the planet is based on 5 biilion people not 10 billion, soon to be 20 billion people.

I agree that industrial fishing is Ecocide, and I call for a reduction in fish.

You are responsible for britian stupid electricity policy, wot no hydro, geothermal, wind, tidal power. Scotland is slightly better, but still not ready for peak problems. Sheffield Area has potential hydro, geothermal & wind BUT nothing has been built yet.

Electric cars will of course mean a doubling of electric use. So its an enourmous task to provide sustainable energy.

The new resources and new materials will mean some new mines & quarries. But with lazer cutting stone supplies it could be low impact. Modern ceramics require less energy than metals.

The global economy is going to grow massivly, no matter what you or me propose. The future can be sustainable, green, and prosperous with food for all.